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Tramp Stamp
12-05-2011, 08:45 PM
EDIT 2013-10-29

I wrote this guide a few days after Modern War’s late November 2011 release. As such, it is likely significantly out of date when factoring hindsight and game changes over a two year span. Please verify information herein with contemporary forum posters. Please do not direct inquiries at me as I retired from the game as of February 2012 and am not privy to any activities since that time. See this post (http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?13937-Suggested-opening-moves-for-an-economy-base&p=1050735&viewfull=1#post1050735) for comments.

Nation selection

UK (Sea Power) is probably the best end game option while China (Infantry) would be the best upfront. Germany (Ground Forces) and Russia (Air) would appear to be in the middle but are probably suboptimal options as sea units aren't significantly more expensive, if at all, and have the benefit of being more durable. I'd like to hear contrasting opinions. There's not much discussion on the topic, and I'm more of an authority on economics than PvP strategy.

Starter gold usage

You technically are not forced to expend gold during the tutorial. While the menu is locked, the timer is still active. Don't beat yourself up if you paid as there isn't anything one can do with the default 10 gold besides speeding up building (or buying a red maple tree). Gold usage for speeding up is max(int(minutes_remaining/12),1). Int() is the integer, or truncate, function, which means to chop off any decimal for a hard round down. For example, 24 minutes, 0 seconds will consume 2 gold (24/12 = 2) while 23 minutes, 59 seconds (23.983333 minutes) divided by 12 is 1.9986. Chop off the decimal and you'll end up at 1. Therefore, for maximum return on initial gold, use it to complete 10 buildings/upgrades with less than 24 minutes remaining. The earlier you use up the gold, the better, in terms of ROI. The max() function guarantees expenditure of at least one gold piece, even if there remains only one second of build time.

Money Building Spreadsheet

<link removed>

Getting started

Build the Barracks as instructed then immediately upgrade it to level 2, which will take an hour. Meanwhile, build two of each money building starting from the least expensive and trigger a land expansion as you will rapidly run out of space. Next, you'll need to get 25 allies onto your list in order to get the $1,000 visitor bonus from each. There aren't (yet) organized resources like there are for Crime City. I suggest harvesting this forum then browsing the comments of the users who accept. App Store reviews are another source. You shouldn't have a problem with getting to 25 in less than an hour, two tops, if you just keep adding numbers while the total is under 25. Make sure to actually visit them to get the bonus. As you collect, take the opportunity to practice using the "Vault" option as it is not automatic. CoachPappy suggests dumping all 10 gold into the VIP system, which will free the player to manage his base and visit automatically added allies. Most likely you will still need to add a healthy amount manually, however.

Once the Barracks finishes upgrading, immediately upgrade one of the Supply Depots, which will cost $1,670. It finishes in 6 minutes. Now mentally set aside $1,670 to upgrade the other Supply Depot and $2,790 to upgrade one to level 3, which takes 30 minutes. With the Supply Depot upgrade in motion and funds earmarked for the next ~40 minutes of upgrades, dump all your remaining cash into Engineers. Don't be shy. The 5-7 you'll be able to afford right now will adequately protect you from level 2 attackers, but they come fast in this game.

Soon you'll be rolling in cash. Your income per hour will exceed $13,000 after a little more than two hours invested. You'll get a significant amount of supplemental income by defending against attacks from players who forgot to vault their money. Next upgrades are the other Supply Depot to level 3, Armories to level 3, Storage Silos to level 3, Supply Depots to level 4. Keep packing on the Engineers. You'll want a minimum of 2x defense to your top rival's attack. Then up that to 3x to give the middle finger to the constant wave of attackers. Don't worry about the high casualty ranking. With so many Engineers you'll totally overrun the opposition and keep them all. 15 Engineers is a good starter amount for levels 2-4, but with the constant wave of attacks you may level up when not paying attention so it helps to be prepared. After 15 Engineers it is recommended to switch to Transports. Modern War allows five allies per level and four units per ally. Worked out, that means up to 20 units at level 1, 40 at level 2, 60 at level 3 and so on.

Once you've set up base camp, so to speak, it's up to you. You have a lot of breathing room as long as you avoid PvP, questing, and goal accomplishment. Fortunately the War Factory isn't awfully useful in the early going, as it is a goal. The rest is wide open, though. I suggest proceeding in this order: always be upgrading money buildings, expand territory to fit all the available money buildings then construct them, add to the vault max, add more land to fit unit buildings then construct them. Remember to build new money buildings as your level is forced higher due to defending attacks. Stockpile powerful units until satisfied then move on.

Note that game mechanics have changed significantly since this guide was created so some items may no longer apply.

downrange
12-05-2011, 09:29 PM
Very nice guide! I did somewhat similar to this and have an economy rated at 47k/hour at level 8. Most of my money buildings are level 3-5 now. I've noticed there are no non-gold money buildings between level 8 and level 12 and I was considering staying here to level my current buildings some more before moving on.

The main difference in our paths is that I did not add allies early, and bought four transports (1:8, but defense of 9 for UK) to maximize my early defense. Attackers were maybe 50% successful anyway, but I kept little unvaulted cash around to compensate. I've finally added some allies in the past few hours, after I had accumulated a few dozen transports/frigates (all defense 8) it seemed almost silly not to. However, my crop of rivals apparently can't resist trying for my cash on hand - I doubt any of them have any clue that my vault is protecting most or all of it. These constant attacks will probably push me up a few levels quickly since i win them all. I may have to rethink having allies for the moment. I was hoping to proceed toward the next crop of money buildings and upgrades with a much higher vault, but the vault expansion is taking forever (working on the 48 hours to 100k) and I may just have to hope i can protect my money with a high defense instead.

whocareswhatmynameis
12-05-2011, 09:36 PM
agree with post. i don't have enough experience to comment on which nation has the advantage.

in addition to what you stated, i wanted to add:

... and don't forget to upgrade your bank!!!

serves 2 purposes:
1) enables you to keep your money safe from rivals as you save for unit/building purchases and, interestingly
2) lures weaker rivals to attack you since they can't figure out if the cash is in the bank or not (i have been pleasantly surprised on several occasions by cash gifts left by my enemies as they lose fights)

Tramp Stamp
12-05-2011, 09:45 PM
Transports are strong. They make a good substitution for players reading this guide after the fact and need buffing at levels 5-15. I'd still recommend Engineers in the first few hours to ward off early losses, but after getting to ~15 I'd say it's up to the player whether to keep packing them on or move on to higher defense units. Even at 60 def, the player should double the best rival's attack value, and the attacker is probably smart enough to avoid people like those who pack on Engineers/Transports.

If you wanted to be sneaky about it, you could add a bunch of allies, visit them for the bonus, delete them then wash, rinse, repeat, but that's awfully tedious for a minimal edge. Plus the supply isn't as great when compared to Crime City and some of them would get annoyed at adding the same dude over and over again. I guess you could add then delete just once. The extra $25,000 in the first hour grants a huge edge.

I, too, was struck by how long vault expansions take. I've been doing it since about the first few minutes of the game and have a measly 50k capacity, which is less than 2 hours income.

downrange
12-05-2011, 09:46 PM
Totally agree about the vault. One of my earliest goals was to be capable of supporting all three types of upgrades at all times: Buildings, Vault, Expansion.

Generating the money for those is not a problem, but holding the money needed for all three types was slightly problematic for me with my no-allies path - this should be considered a factor in favor of Tramp Stamp's recommendation. Eventually the vault had grown and the various upgrade times get so long that there's little overlap. Time is the limiting factor from very early on, and looks to be that way as far out as I can see. ALWAYS be upgrading all three, regardless of need.

Tramp Stamp
12-05-2011, 10:00 PM
wupuck had it right in another thread: the vault is a nifty back door method of generating more action between players. Funzio wants you to have the upgrades but they also want to expose more of your cash than what happens in Crime City. I guess they didn't expect nearly everyone to take the 10% hit on every last dollar. The implications are that the player should be constantly spending money to remain under the radar. Popeye asked me how I was able to remain "hidden"; maybe it was because I was constantly funneling cash into upgrades, buildings (any of them, even if I didn't need them), vault increases, and land expansion (again, even if I didn't exactly need it at the moment). Now it gets tough as I need to upgrade the unit buildings to access the higher ticket purchases but that takes away from money buildings, but stockpiling cash promotes attacks...

P.S. I just lost my first Engineer. Guess it's time to move to Transports. I wish I had picked UK. I'm not a fan of this practice of forcing the player to make an uninformed decision then trying to get $5 out of him once data becomes available.

downrange
12-05-2011, 10:13 PM
I've already lost one Transport, to a successfully defended attack, but was weak relative to my rivals list at that time. I had 5 or more at the time and only 4 in play, so it wasn't that big of a deal. Just annoying that i took a 15k loss as a result of someone's utterly futile attempt to grab at my fully-vaulted 50k at the time.

downrange
12-05-2011, 10:17 PM
Oops, my mistake. I just double checked that and i did lose the fight when I lost that Transport. My rival got a whopping 0 money though.

Tramp Stamp
12-05-2011, 10:21 PM
I won the fight, but I had a ridiculous 70 Engineers at level 4. I wouldn't be surprised if I was past the game's "sweet spot" in terms of how it calculates attrition. I can't check his stats, but I'm pretty sure I outclassed him by at least 10:1.

Tramp Stamp
12-05-2011, 10:36 PM
I should note that, at least with levels 1-4, the rivals list is a slop bucket where people with 2 allies comingle with guys with 15 so I don't think adding allies early makes a difference. This could easily change if this game picks up and becomes more popular and/or more people adopt strategies like what was outlined here.

downrange
12-05-2011, 10:39 PM
I think the vault is one of the [sadly few] things they got right in this successor to CC. You're spot on with the comment that the 10% banking hit on unlimited money was more imbalancing than the devs likely anticipated. This helped allow even the most extremely weak players to squirrel away money for capital improvements that otherwise could've been exposed to stronger players while it was being accumulated. They may have over-compensated with the massively-incrementing build times on the Vault upgrades, but I am only 3 days in, so I will state that cautiously for now.

As for where to funnel the money... I'm hitting that as well, which is why I'm frustrated by the low vault level relative to my other economic progress. The devs likely want that though. Big gold buyers undoubtedly want action at all levels, and one of them at my level would just love to come across me as I'm saving for a massive building upgrade that's 2 or 3 or [very soon, now] many many times the limit of my vault.

downrange
12-05-2011, 10:56 PM
Actually, my experience with rivals list in levels 1-4 was less variable. Nobody over an ally count of 1 ever saw/sees me. That's actually key to that low ally strategy. I can see the occasional couple of rivals with lots of allies, but they don't see me.

I haven't posted yet about my still-lvl-3 account, so here goes. Turtling that one has been surprisingly successful so far. There are one or two risks I can think up for this strategy, but so far it's been completely under the radar with a perfect record, attacks have completely dropped off after 10 successful defends, and it also has an economy rated at 40+k/hour. It already has the Dry Docks (second level of ship facility) under construction and many hundreds of thousands waiting to be used on dry dock upgrades and/or advanced sea units. All three upgrade types have been running full time. If things continue as well as they have been, all the additional cash that i unfortunately can't currently reinvest into raw economic base will be going into dry dock upgrades and just enough very high cost ships for a one ally character to be near unattackable for at least as long as it takes to carry a few million into the rest of the early levels and dump it into those buildings/upgrades. That's my current situation and hope; I'll see if it pans out.

Tramp Stamp
12-05-2011, 10:59 PM
That's interesting. What's your opinion on the hit 'n run ally bonus tactic? Valuable for the 1st hour bonus or too risky even in the short term for the reward?

downrange
12-05-2011, 11:14 PM
I considered it too risky, though it probably actually isn't. Really, i just didn't need it. With almost no need or reason to pour money into units, I had plenty available from those early laundry^H^H^H^H^H supply depots and other massively high ROI buildings, that i don't recall having much of an early cash flow issue. If i waited for the cash for an early upgrade or two it would've been very short lived. While I certainly don't like any sub-optimal path, reality is that an early half hour wait at a spot or two is easily justified away with "well i didn't even download the game for a couple whole DAYS that it was first available [in the US]". =)

Tramp Stamp
12-05-2011, 11:29 PM
A note about the guide is that it doesn't reflect exactly what I did but what I should have done in hindsight. The 7 losses attributed to me were due to being slow about pursuing defensive upgrades. Initially I figured that level 1-2 players would be too busy leveling up by questing and completing goals to participate in PvP, but that was erroneous, at least in my case. The $25k bonus is really a panic move to get the Engineers going while not sacrificing growth of Laundro^L Supply Depots. As you said, the cash flow issue is transient, easily solvable by a 1 hour infusion. I guess if it were to be codified, one should start his game somewhere around, well, now, when most of U.S. and Europe are asleep. I think I started my game somewhere around 8 PM EST, which I think is worldwide peak time.

downrange
12-06-2011, 12:52 AM
I suppose on that note -- sorry if this is venturing into stealing your thread -- I'll mention what I would do differently in hindsight as well.

For my 'downrange' account I'd do it according to your guide. It seems to solve the issues I came across, particularly the issue of relying on the vault so heavily early on because I was so weak. I had to "use it or lose it" with my money early on since even 36 defense is not enough to stop rivals with 20 atk or less from grabbing my unprotected money. They never got much from me; the sum totals are pathetically low. But it kept me from optimizing my upgrades since I was disinclined to keep adequate cash on hand. I sometimes picked a cheaper upgrade than the optimal one, because I had a self-imposed ceiling equivalent to 1.2 or 1.3x my vault maximum, and you simply cannot control when your building cash matures. You can plan for it, but can't control it.

For my ultra-turtle account, I'd have invested those first 6 stat points in defense, and I would not have built the shipyard. I actually sold the shipyard because I had 560k burning a hole in my pocket by the end of day 2, and had not expanded into a second coastline square. My dry docks are there now (still under construction, takes 48 hours) and i can rebuild the shipyard once that second coastline expansion finishes up. A note about the expansions. First coastline expansion should be into the farthest 'southwest' square immediately touching the original four; it perfectly fits either of those two ship facilities, whereas the other further south square requires that your ship facility intrude by one space into the 'original four'.
The keys to this turtling:
- no PVP or PVE (obviously). none. i landed at lvl 3 and have not been 'pushed' farther since
- build the high-ROI buildings first according to Tramp's guide
- no Ally adds
- invest in four Transports (sea units) early
- you may need to simply 'get lucky' a bit regarding other players attacking
I was attacked and won five times in level 2 and got a couple k from it each time. This eventually pushed me to level 3, where the attacks continued five more times, then stopped. I can't explain it, but I haven't been attacked now in over 24 hours. ymmv.
You probably want to be at level 3 because the Munitions Stockpile is a better 24 hour building than the command center. But I've seen a player with an alternative ultra-turtle strategy that intrigues me. She's still at level 2 and apparently opted for effectively no defense at all. This allows her to camp indefinitely (without the risk that i have of being pushed farther against my will) because she loses all attacks and raids, so gains no XP from those external factors. I suspect there's an absolute limit to the amount she can lose each time, probably somewhat level-based and possibly limited to those very early levels to somewhat protect new players (guessing?). She's holding several thousand in cash and it's not vanishing. If folks can relate relevant experiences, please do.

I think i intended to write more, but I'm over tired. Calling it done.

Popeye The Sailor Man
12-06-2011, 12:56 AM
However remember that in this game your encomical power is artificially inflated because unless you play every 5 minutes you arnt collect you whole income per hour no only that this game has alot lower number of buildings before higher levels that collect after longer intervals. Maybe because the early player will play more I donno.

downrange
12-06-2011, 01:43 AM
Popeye, you're absolutely correct. I referred to it as "rated at 47k/hour" for that exact reason. I do set a 5 minute timer so i can do other things and collect quite regularly (but not always, of course) fairly easily without disrupting my day too much otherwise. But we all sleep sometime at the very least [arg, i need to go do that, now!], and have other obligations as well. I suppose I could add up the values of a lot of my upgrades and buildings and units etc, but just counting cash, and guessing - i think today (day 3) I cleared 400-500k on the lvl3 account, which is rated at 43k/hour currently. Folks situations will vary, but there are enough options available even at lvl3 (especially with that 24-hour Munitions Stockpile!) for a wide range of player schedules to successfully start a meaningful base economy.

And for me, it's as much about getting through the upgrade timers as it is about accumulating cash. I think those will limit growth and expansion as much or more than money will. I was somewhat dismayed that I couldn't immediately reinvest my first couple hundred thousand and was about to give up on the turtling when I realized that holding out a bit longer and building the second-tier ship facility would make excellent use of that cash. Now when I get to the lvl 12+ money buildings, I have a 48-hour-construction wait already out of my way (though construction time hasn't been limiting yet). I'll still have to see if upgrading it to lvl 2 or 3 makes sense based on the [unknown to me] timers on it, but if I pursue those as well, it will again free up that same time for when i have access to more money buildings later.

skunk
12-06-2011, 03:40 AM
Tramp
Nice guide, but I went the opposite way :)
All out attack, at levels 1-10 you can easily get $10k per attack, in the first 10 levels, I had terrible difficulty spending the money, vaults expansions and upgrades took ever so long compared to the $100k I was getting every 20 minutes when my stamina refilled!

One down side is you level up quickly, especially if you play the story as well. I hit level 25 in 2 days but my attack/def is still above average at 1300 each it has been at 1300 since level 10 tho as the more I raid, the more troops I lose.
Game mechanics and attrition rates are in another post.
I'd love to know what your thoughts are on how to play once you get past level 10. Attacking option is negated, which means defense is useless too - it only leaves story to play? And that does pay massve sums of money compared to CC with $20k beaing awared for some challenges even early on.

Popeye The Sailor Man
12-06-2011, 04:42 AM
Skunk what happens when the winning streak goals end and valour is rare... Respect is hard to come by nowadays and on cc I don't lost the units I brought with the valour/respect

In the same breath of hating the fact so many people have attacked me I have noticed this has given me around $500 a attack... It does acumalate and do far only had like 2 transports disappear In the sea of notifications

skunk
12-06-2011, 08:21 AM
Youre dead right Popeye.
But if the PvP economics are not resolved soon I, like most people, will abandon the game.
If I stick it out a little longer than others, there will be plenty of farmsagain :)
Or they fix the economics and I'm OK and can continue to raid people trusting that I play more then the average player.

Either way the gfame is not going to keep going as is and something has to change.
Just hope I can put up with it till it does.
I'll give it to the end of the week.

skunk

Agent Orange
12-06-2011, 08:22 AM
Nice guide.

Some important things to consider, if you add too many allies it also bumps you up into a higher group of rivals. I just noticed Popeye in my rival list so I paid him a visit, sorry man you should have accepted my invite last week. ;^)

youj had said the game will move weaker players into a higher rival list if that list runs out or people and that seems to be what is happening. I'm at level 55 with only 3 players at my level or higher out of 15 listed. The highest I've seen is someone over L60 and he's grouped into this list.

At the higher levels you get huge valor bonus for attacking rivals, I know the comment was not to use these up but after being screwed over on the Stealth Frigates I don't care. If the bonus runs out I quit.

The most clever player I've seen is one who has kept to 3 allies as this puts him in with the group of new weak players or those who aren't leveling up fast. He also has a number nighthawks, did he really spend money on 1200 gold or is he a dev or friend of the devs? On that note I too notice some oddities with some players who have some powerful weapons that required higher level unit buildings yet they don't have these on their base. Odd, who are these players.

If you remove a building the units available to that building are no longer available. Also if you sell a building you get approx half it's original value.

You can move buildings but you cannot move the base squares that they are built on. Those building the sub pen might be screwed if they build slightly over land.

If you are building a lot of money buildings you will get raided by more powerful players, there are defensive buildings but I have no idea how they are factored into the mix. You will see a blue halo around these buildings and that is their protective range so I put a defensive building in the middle of the group of buildings that I want protected. Also some defensive buildings use diffferent sized spaces though the turret and sams use the same.

I would not buy any gold armor once in the higher levels as their bang for the buck is greatly dimished. Not sure how to explain this well but a lot of valor units can eventually equalize the attack advantage of one high attack value unit. If I was starting out I would consider $20 worth of something.

Once in the higher levels having a lot of allies IS important as this allows you to bring more units into battle. Some of the more clever folks are buying a lot of lower units.

Also take advantage of some of the loot in the map challenges though once you get to the Marketplace you start to need to buy a lot of units that may not fit into your overall strategy. That was were I stopped. Here's a nugget, you can go back and re-attack anything in the map challenges so make notes...

Also note that some of the loot changes, for example in one spot you can get oil aircraft carriers, oil destroyers, or mine sweepers along with cash.

Also a lot of things changed a week ago so some of my notes are NFG now but someone starting up now should be good.

I use my vault though a big thank you to those who don't! Since a lot of higher level units need upwards of 500,000 you leave yourself open to a lot of poaching.

As you go higher up in the levels everything takes longer and gets more expensive. For example base expansions, at L55 it costs 260,000 and takes 48 hours though that seems actually a bit lower than I recall.

The game has lots of potential but the continued crashing and odd ways of calculating battles, oh yeah I forgot that one. I've lost attacks to rivals who seem to be weaker so the defensive values are not all of the equation, must be factored with your skill pts too. This seemed to kick in the past couple of days as I have not had attack surprises before today.

Tramp Stamp
12-06-2011, 08:24 AM
your encomical power is artificially inflated because unless you play every 5 minutes you arnt collect you whole income per hour

That's true, though I think most forum members use the figure as a rough guide as the game doesn't provide much in the way of metrics. However, I will say that during the first few hours of play the number is very accurate as it's not a stretch to play for 2-3 hours more or less straight initially setting the base up.

Also someone added "ROI clicks", or the number of collections one needs to make in order to pay off the construction/upgrade, to the spreadsheet. This is a good idea and I'll add this to the Crime City sheet as well at some point as it will be helpful to players who don't collect all day but could still benefit from even suboptimal payout schedules.

Tramp Stamp
12-06-2011, 08:40 AM
if you add too many allies it also bumps you up into a higher group of rivals.

When I get the chance, I will update the guide with this concern. Despite the downsides I'll probably keep the allies as everyone else seems to be doing the opposite. That way we can compare the fallout later. Overnight I was pushed to level 5 and the attacks are still coming, though in waves. I attribute the inconsistency to suboptimal rival list generation. I can't think of another reason I'm attacked several times within a few minutes then no activity for several hours. My base is a downright honeypot.

Agent Orange
12-06-2011, 09:04 AM
Just to clarify something skunk posted, if you remove allies it will drop your defence and attack values and I suspect this is the game trying to match players with the same number of allies. But this also drops you back a few groups in terms of the rival list so if you are getting murdered because the game has grouped you in with more powerful players with similar ally count but not nessessarily level then you might have no choice but to drop back OR build more defenses fast.

The game seems to group folks in terms of level, and number of allies, hence the guy with 3 that is mopping up there also seem to be cutoff points. Eg 0-30 allies seems to be one grouping, then under 100 then over 100. Numbers are guesses based on the limited data I"ve been collecting but would be good to hear from people in those ranges to get a feel for where the cutoffs are.

looker
12-06-2011, 10:38 AM
Also someone added "ROI clicks",

That was me. On my personal spread sheet I have 3 additional columns.
1 - The ROI Click one I added
2 - estimates how many times im actually able to collect in a day (this would vary person to person)
3 - another ROI of my clicks vs click ROI -- (this is the weighting I use to determine what to build next.)



But I've seen a player with an alternative ultra-turtle strategy that intrigues me. She's still at level 2 and apparently opted for effectively no defense at all. This allows her to camp indefinitely (without the risk that i have of being pushed farther against my will) because she loses all attacks and raids, so gains no XP from those external factors. I suspect there's an absolute limit to the amount she can lose each time, probably somewhat level-based and possibly limited to those very early levels to somewhat protect new players (guessing?).

I think downrange was referring to my account (Thanks for not identifying me.) My strategy has worked so far. Still lvl 2, and just leveling money buildings. My goal ATM is to stay at lvl 2 and get buildings to 10. I realized that no matter what, I cant prevent people from attacking me, so the only way not to get XP is to lose battles, and so I dont build units or defense, (I've had 0 defense since my Storm Leader got killed.)

Currently I have 400+ Allies, so maybe there are now enough people (level 3+) so that I dont show up on many rival lists. Perhaps theres some sort of beginner protection because the only people who seem to attack me are lvl 2. Once they hit me 2 or 3 times they go to level 3 and I'm guessing I'm off their radar. In the news notices, I notice they either get $0, $1000, $2000, or $3000, so maybe theres a cap. It seems that attacks have dropped significantly. I try to not take the attacks personally and just think of the losses as the cost of doing business.

My ultra-turtle strategy is long and boring, but in the end I think will be strong. It seems this is a fast game than CC. I get cash faster and upgrade faster.. or maybe its perception since all my CC building take 30+ hrs for UG's. I 'm also figuring that the Devs may make more changes/tweaks as time goes on. So in a month when I have crazy cash production I can learn from others and invest properly.

Tramp Stamp
12-06-2011, 11:01 AM
A note, the poorly labeled H, M, and S fields are meant to include partial payouts to roll into ROI. For some reason it works in this sheet but not Crime City.

Popeye The Sailor Man
12-06-2011, 11:12 AM
Agent you must of attacked someone else still have 13 loses 250k on hand and 500 wins and 7 Allies I'll post a screen shot when I learn how

Agent Orange
12-06-2011, 11:31 AM
Right you are, there is another Popeye then. This one's L35 (I think, I leveled up again so they dropped off my rivals list) but also had low losses er well until I got curious earlier. They must be wondering WTF I was talking about on their wall heh heh.

Agent Orange
12-06-2011, 04:00 PM
My ultra-turtle strategy is long and boring, but in the end I think will be strong. It seems this is a fast game than CC. I get cash faster and upgrade faster.. or maybe its perception since all my CC building take 30+ hrs for UG's. I 'm also figuring that the Devs may make more changes/tweaks as time goes on. So in a month when I have crazy cash production I can learn from others and invest properly.

That might be a better strategy, as you get up to the higher levels everything starts to take longer to build. I thought when I first started to play that I noticed build times for the same buildings and land were increasing as I leveled up for the same upgrade or building. Though there have been a lot of changes to the game since then so this could be wrong.

Interesting, that many allies but being L3 keeps you off the radar.

Agent Orange
12-06-2011, 04:02 PM
Agent you must of attacked someone else still have 13 loses 250k on hand and 500 wins and 7 Allies I'll post a screen shot when I learn how

Yup he's a poser then, L33 391 missions, 1270 fights, 105 lost, 144 raids, 0 failed, 292 alliance members. He's getting wall messages from folks thinking he's you. I thought he was so kind of hesitated to attack him. Now....

downrange
12-06-2011, 07:44 PM
Thanks looker. Yup, that was you I was referring to, and I am quite impressed with your strategy! Sorry to have 'outed' the concept if you had preferred it to remain private. I had noticed that I won exact multiples of 500 (seems to be multiples of 1000 for your losses) while in level 2. Then the numbers got more variable (but lower) after I was pushed to level 3. I assumed this was partly because folks had spent through some of their original money by then before attacking me. In any case, with your experience added in, I feel comfortable assuming that the money loss rate appears capped for at least some initial levels.

I had intended when I first read this to reply that I would employ your strategy if i had to start over. I'm working on my sad story for another thread, but the punchline is that my lvl 3 camper died and I started a new character while waiting for Support to resurrect him. So at this point I am employing your 'no units' strategy. Only been hit once so far!

I agree completely with your thoughts on the economic focus. It's bound to be a solid way to go for the lifetime of this game, but especially while they tweak the other game mechanics. Economy will reign in this game, no doubt, and the rest of it seems to still need significant development attention.

Tramp Stamp
12-07-2011, 09:53 AM
Just shy of being pushed to level 6, the set of Engineers is not only holding strong but still totally overwhelms the opposition. Most of the rivals still have attack rates of 15-30 vs my 272 defense (plus 10 skill points). There are a few a bit better, still well below my rank, but these guys probably know better than to attack me. I have not lost a single fight since my early response to 7 losses.

In addition to the previously reported single loss of an Engineer, another has appeared, though, curiously, such was not reported in the feed. Still a small sample size, but with losing 2 Engineers in 113 battles it would appear they have something like a baseline 2% attrition rate in effect.

Agent Orange
12-07-2011, 10:06 AM
I think the vault is one of the [sadly few] things they got right in this successor to CC. You're spot on with the comment that the 10% banking hit on unlimited money was more imbalancing than the devs likely anticipated. This helped allow even the most extremely weak players to squirrel away money for capital improvements that otherwise could've been exposed to stronger players while it was being accumulated. They may have over-compensated with the massively-incrementing build times on the Vault upgrades, but I am only 3 days in, so I will state that cautiously for now.

FYI, the devs also changed the build times and amounts the vault could hold. A couple of us had 1 day in on a 2 day vault upgrade to 1,000,000 when it suddenly reset to 100 hours and when it completed it was only for 750,000. Posted an email to support that was ignored.

bredo2
12-07-2011, 10:41 AM
iam about 100+ hours in vault upgrades and currently awaiting 150k protection lol. How the hell you guys got 1 mill in 2 days?

looker
12-07-2011, 10:48 AM
Im in the same boat, 24 more hrs for 100K vault.. they must have changed the formula and the early adopters got their vaults grandfathered.

Tramp Stamp
12-07-2011, 11:50 AM
I think the vault is one of the [sadly few] things they got right in this successor to CC.

It's looking more and more like they got this wrong, too. After a few days--or even hours--the limits provide no effective protection. Meanwhile income grows exponentially faster and attacks keep coming. At this point it's a nicety to throw some money at and not a serious investment.

downrange
12-07-2011, 12:57 PM
Agreed. Since I've always got the cash available anyway, I'll keep upgrading it, but it sure feels pointless. Earlier today I started the 100K -> 150K vault upgrade, which is going to take 60 hours. ugh.

I held between 300K and 700K during the day yesterday, and similarly outclass my rivals (at least defensively) who for whatever reason just cannot resist trying to grab my hoard. The best streak so far was winning 2K+ four times in a row (all different rivals) over the course of an hour or two. I'm not trying to use the baiting strategy, but apparently can't avoid it right now.

Agent Orange
12-07-2011, 01:19 PM
iam about 100+ hours in vault upgrades and currently awaiting 150k protection lol. How the hell you guys got 1 mill in 2 days?

As mentioned the devs changed this to 100 hours before we got our vaults built. So it's 100 hours for even the smaller vaults? That is bad.

BTW Tramp Stamp your MW id comes up not found.

Tramp Stamp
12-07-2011, 01:21 PM
Bought 10 Transports for the hell of it. Now my defense is 352, back up to 10:1 over just about everyone else's attack score. Despite doing just about everything I can to dump cash and put up a terrifying defensive score they keep coming. I'm not worried a bit about the inevitable level ups. It's hard to see how I'll ever lose a battle.

Tramp Stamp
12-07-2011, 01:24 PM
BTW Tramp Stamp your MW id comes up not found.

Numpad-related typo fixed, thanks.

Agent Orange
12-07-2011, 01:28 PM
Heh heh heh after all that I enter the number and it pops up that we are already allies!

NeonBlue
12-07-2011, 09:00 PM
Thanks for the guide Tramp Stamp. I hope you'll keep posting as you progress your strategy.

I'm trying your "semi-turtle" method on one account and looker's "ultra turtle" on the other. It's been tough staying at level 2 because I keep winning against attacks (!). I finally had to kill off both my guys by attacking the strongest rival in my list until my units were killed, and I'm hoping that will keep me from winning any more.

A question for looker - I'm looking for cash dumps, since upgrades and expansions can't keep up with my income. I'm thinking about buying a bunch of Light Gunners (1/0). I figure since they add no defense, they don't add to the risk of accidental leveling, and might come in handy later, once I start playing an offensive game. Any thoughts?

Tramp Stamp
12-07-2011, 09:49 PM
I noticed you still had a defense of 1 before and had somehow won 3 battles. Nice idea to seek out strong rivals as a suicidal strategy. Are you purposely keeping allies around 25 or is that just what you've wound up with? Interesting move to head straight for Dry Docks, but why did you pick Russia?

I like the "semi-turtle" label as it explains the strategy perfectly. You do gain levels; I wouldn't be surprised to get to level 7 within 24 hours, but if you focus on money building upgrades and defensive units you'll still absolutely slaughter the opposition. I don't know if my strategy is obvious or if people are actually heeding the guide but I've seen several players following it to the letter, right down to the money building upgrade order and Engineer stockpiling.

I think the sweet spot for Engineers is about 15. After that Transports should be affordable and the recommended path. I wonder if Funzio recently modified the Engineer attrition rate. After losing just one after >100 battles, after 137 I've lost 3 more.

Did I add your other account?

looker
12-07-2011, 10:38 PM
A question for looker - I'm looking for cash dumps, since upgrades and expansions can't keep up with my income. I'm thinking about buying a bunch of Light Gunners (1/0). I figure since they add no defense, they don't add to the risk of accidental leveling, and might come in handy later, once I start playing an offensive game. Any thoughts?

I think I may run into that problem soon. Right now I'm just keeping the cash as I dont get robbed often and when I do, its not losing very much (less than the 10% if they had a bank here) I've also tweaked my build strategy slightly. Since I'm making income faster than I can spend it, I decided to build my command center when ever I can. Even though the ROI isnt as great, the daily income far exceeds the other building. At this point the expansion, ComCtr, and Vault are all running over 24hr build times since i'm not spending money on troops, may as well invest large. I've also considered building the Unit buildings, but think that may make me more of a target for Valor collectors.

Tramp Stamp
12-07-2011, 11:13 PM
I wouldn't be surprised to get to level 7 within 24 hours

Uh, make that about 15 minutes. Two people attacked me and somehow I'm 12 points away from gaining a level. I think I just gained 50+ exp. How does that happen? Time for more transports I guess. 536 defense now.

jlhy
12-08-2011, 12:09 AM
Same thing happened to me. Funzio added more starter goals today. Thats probably what gave you the extra xp. Probably added a building or expanding goal that you already did and you got the xp automatically. It kinda ticked me off since I was sitting at a nice cushiony 110 xp till level 10 now i'm 7xp away from leveling.

Tramp Stamp
12-08-2011, 12:20 AM
You're right. I had 3 goals and now have 8. Did I even get rewarded monetarily? Doesn't seem like it, not that it matters. I feel sorry for the people spending money on this game.

Nicz
12-08-2011, 04:35 AM
Ty for those advices!
I rushed level 19 too quickly, and began to make the same mistakes that i did on CC...
Only 12k/h, but since yesterday i raised it to 40k (work in progress), all of my money buildings are lvl 3/4...just two of them are lvl 2 (but i chose quick upgrades...)
My defence is now at 850, it still progress, and i've 60 engineers and 25 boats (dont remember the name)
Vault to 100k in progress too and i did 7 expensions :)

Ill continu to read this topic, and thx again :)

EDIT: If u want add me, 379 107 891, and tell me ur name here, i got already 100 requests...
Btw, i get attack 20 times since yesterday...18 wins, that's great, but i didnt win so much money :(

NeonBlue
12-08-2011, 09:39 AM
I noticed you still had a defense of 1 before and had somehow won 3 battles. Nice idea to seek out strong rivals as a suicidal strategy. Are you purposely keeping allies around 25 or is that just what you've wound up with? Interesting move to head straight for Dry Docks, but why did you pick Russia?

...

Did I add your other account?

I don't have a Dry Docks yet...maybe you spotted my then-in-progress Shipyard? As for Russia...no good reason, I am UK on my other acct and figured I should try something different. And I wanted enough allies to max out the daily bonus, but didn't want to risk any more than that for now.

I don't know much about how the game works yet; I keep hoping someone will write a "Guide to MW for CC Players" to explain all the differences.

My semi-turtle is "River" - I'll send you an invite. I'm still level 4 on that one, getting attacked but apparently not as frequently as you are.

NeonBlue
12-08-2011, 09:48 AM
I think I may run into that problem soon. Right now I'm just keeping the cash as I dont get robbed often and when I do, its not losing very much (less than the 10% if they had a bank here) I've also tweaked my build strategy slightly. Since I'm making income faster than I can spend it, I decided to build my command center when ever I can. Even though the ROI isnt as great, the daily income far exceeds the other building. At this point the expansion, ComCtr, and Vault are all running over 24hr build times since i'm not spending money on troops, may as well invest large. I've also considered building the Unit buildings, but think that may make me more of a target for Valor collectors.

Ah, I didn't realize there was a cap on robberies. That makes me feel better about leaving some cash exposed.

I had noticed your Com Ctr was pretty high up there. Nice!

I went ahead and built unit buildings, but I didn't realize that could make me more of a target. I guess that's just part of the way you have to already know how the game works to make good early decisions. I'm still not clear on why I should even mind being targeted, at least now that I've killed off my army.

I have to say I'm fascinated by your land expansion pattern. Are you spelling something? Or drawing a picture in giant land-pixels?

Tramp Stamp
12-08-2011, 10:31 AM
I spotted River before and figured it was someone reading these forums.


I went ahead and built unit buildings, but I didn't realize that could make me more of a target.

Me either. I also built the unit buildings to shed cash and because one generally should be maximizing building resources in Funzio games. I asked on my wall what's the motivation for attacking me. I'll share the (meaningful) replies here if I get any.


I have to say I'm fascinated by your land expansion pattern. Are you spelling something? Or drawing a picture in giant land-pixels?

I am, too. That "doughnut" drives me nuts, haha.

downrange
12-08-2011, 11:09 AM
I've been constructing the Unit Buildings as well. At one point quite early on, nervous about how much unprotected money I had accumulated, I sold the Shipyard to free up my only available coastline square at the time for Dry Docks. I realized a secondary benefit of constructing the Unit Buildings; they can serve as a supplemental "bank" of sorts. Now, this works best if you don't upgrade them - which is exactly the case for me; all of my building upgrade time is focused on Money Buildings still. If I have a quick need for money later, I can sell any of the un-upgraded Unit Buildings for 50%. I'd need to factor in any upcoming plans to buy that type of unit, and current/upcoming construction needs, but construction time is the least constrained of the various timers for me so far. There are other considerations too, but I almost think of my recent Unit Building constructions (that I otherwise don't need right now) as not too far off from a 50% supplementary 'bank/vault'. It's like the Bank in CC, but it costs 50% instead of 10% and it requires/uses otherwise-unused map space, etc. Food for thought, for some folks, perhaps.

On the flip side... as i typed this, my War Factory on my 'slower' account just finished. Overnight it had been pushed from lvl-3 to lvl-4 due to the development changes. I forgot why I had been leaving the War Factory out of my build plans, and now remember... the additional Goal-based XP pushed that account to lvl-5. Oops. Oh well, now that account gets Wind Farms I suppose.

looker
12-08-2011, 11:15 AM
I have to say I'm fascinated by your land expansion pattern. Are you spelling something? Or drawing a picture in giant land-pixels?


I am, too. That "doughnut" drives me nuts, haha.

LOL - Well im curious by nature, and look for game defects. I was wondering what would happen if I surrounded an area.. like would I get it for free. I did notice that as I build around, one of the directional expansion arrows changed direction once.

I though of spelling something, but all squares need to be attached on the sides.. then I got bored.

downrange
12-08-2011, 01:17 PM
... the additional Goal-based XP pushed that account to lvl-5. Oops. Oh well, now that account gets Wind Farms I suppose.

update: I think the next goal related to Collecting 5 times, and I may have hit that one too. In any case, I'm now a single point away from hitting lvl-6. Strong warning to ultra-turtlers out there about constructing the War Factory.

update2: And the next goal after that was apparently about constructing Air Base, which pushed me to lvl-6. I should've kept a closer watch on the goals, but most of them seemed ridiculous... "Build a Railgun"? srsly? That'll be cluttering my Goals until i hit level 80 and drop 6million on it? no really, they're serious?!? "Expand your Base 35 Times" is pretty rich too. Do i get a meta-Bonus on that Bonus if i prove it's even possible to do that before St Patricks day?

Agent Orange
12-08-2011, 03:39 PM
One thing I'm not sure of but it feels to me as if moving up in the levels adds to the construction time. I wish I had tracked this data in the beginning but on top of the bump ups in time for the upgrades it felt like this time changed as you went further up in the levels for the same upgrade.

I posted some observations a couple of weeks ago here, http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?13400-Inital-10-gold.

downrange
12-08-2011, 04:05 PM
I was just posting in another thread that I feel as though I've noticed the opposite. That build times decreased (or stayed the same for two successive expansions, for a 'relative' decrease) at least one time that I noticed, specifically for Base Expansions. Since I am playing two accounts I can track them, and my lower level account is currently experiencing vastly higher Base Expansion times vs my slightly higher level account. This has resulted in a situation where the two accounts' Vault upgrade paths and cost are tracking identically to each other, but the available land area is different and increasingly diverging.

Counting the squares was getting annoying, but I've found a use for the "Expand your Base 35 Times" Goal... it counts my existing land expansions for me. (9/35) vs (6/35) The two major differences are: player level, and one account is played on an iPhone vs the other on an iPad. Maybe it's just a bug, but I *want* there to be a reason, and for that reason to be logical. Best I can come up with is that as we level up the relative times can come down. I'd like this to be the case for the Vault too, but I doubt it'd apply to any Buildings, if it's a real effect at all. It certainly also could be that the rules changed mid-stream and one account got grandfathered, where the other did not.

Curiously, the Base Expansion costs have tracked together too, which led me to question initially if the diverging timer values I saw were just a mistake, but now that I see so clearly just how far off the number of expansions is, I wonder if the costs of Base Expansions might drop as player level increases too.

Please folks, relate your experiences with this. The more data points, the better. Let's please keep the variables down though... don't really want a repeat of the "two different costs for some weapons" thread in the CC forums -- "maybe it depends on male/female, etc". Who knows, it may just turn out to be that they're testing different policy effects with different pools of players before they settle on one particular graduating path.

Certes
12-08-2011, 04:08 PM
I don't think it does. I'm lvl5 and my dry docks are taking 48hrs.

downrange
12-08-2011, 04:21 PM
I don't think it does. I'm lvl5 and my dry docks are taking 48hrs.

To clarify,
I think Building Construction and Building Upgrade times/costs are static, and suspect they always will be.
I think Base Expansion times/costs might be influenced by player level (i.e., there is a set schedule/progression, but at specific levels the player gets bumped down a notch on the scale)
I hope Vault Expansion times/costs might similarly scale downwards as player-level increases, but that is just blind hope born out of frustration with how long the timers have got, and there is zero evidence to support this.

Agent Orange
12-08-2011, 06:04 PM
It's possible it has changed, for a strategy game it really bites to have the devs make adjustments midgame as it tosses your strategy out the window in some case. I know the vault times did change which screwed up a couple of us. When I did my last vault upgrade, 500,000 to supposedly 1,000,000 it was going to take 48 hours. When I had gone 24 hours my timer suddenly rest to 100 hours and when the upgrade completed it was only 750,000 so I would say the 750,000 is now 100 hours. Whoops it's not, a buddy is telling me the upgrade to 750k is 120 hours and 175k. I think the vault costs and upgrade times are indeed static across the levels.

Best I can do is this, I'm at L 57 and to upgrade my vault from 750,000 to 1,000,000 will cost 200,000 and take 132 hours. i've got three hours left on a base expansion so I can't tell you the time yet or cost as I don't remember but I'll try and post back in 3-4 hours when it's done. I just started an upgrade to L2 for a steel mill, which is going to take 16 hours and I think cost $350,000. If there's something someone wants me to check so we can do a comparison post it here and I'll try and check back before I do any more upgrades.

Could just be that the devs were making changes to the times as I was playing and that's why I'm all screwed up now.

Tramp Stamp
12-08-2011, 10:23 PM
Wow, 197 wins already. Now I'm adding Transports just to be a jerk. Defense is up to 656. Somebody responded to my request for info as to what makes me a target with, "I attack u and I win". Promptly after he lost and gave me $423.

NeonBlue
12-09-2011, 05:50 AM
I just lost my first Engineer on my semi-turtle account (level 5, def 247). Amusingly, my would-be attacker lost just over $4000 to me in the fight. Now wasn't that considerate of them?

Unrelated question: is there any point in preparing to support off-spec units? By which I mean, if I'm a Brit, is there a reason to build unit buildings to unlock air and ground units, or will I be purchasing exclusively sea power throughout my career, most likely?

skunk
12-09-2011, 06:13 AM
Unrelated question: is there any point in preparing to support off-spec units? By which I mean, if I'm a Brit, is there a reason to build unit buildings to unlock air and ground units, or will I be purchasing exclusively sea power throughout my career, most likely?

You need a well rounded army to compete.
Stock up on meat sheilds and make sure they are used, you'll notice that the attrition rates are lower on your high priced items if you have more light gunners and scouts. But you gotta be using them in the battle.
So it dosn't pay to have few allies as you'll only use top stuff and only lose top stuff !

Popeye The Sailor Man
12-09-2011, 06:53 AM
Do we know if this meat shield thing even works?
Besides when upgrading your units you should have spear units luring around... I'm focusing of sea.... Sea where it takes me... Although I'm wondering if russia would of been a better choice...

Agent Orange
12-09-2011, 08:20 AM
Popeye, the optimist in me says yes as I have a lot of scouts but as I look at my stats I seem to notice that at a certain point they don't add anything to my stats so building a 1000 doesn't make sense. For my level and number of allies I have just over 333. I have several hundred transports and medics. Have some high value attack units, but the mechanics of fighting make no sense to me. I can loose lots of scouts then suddenly a high valor unit, perhaps there is something factored into all units as some say strong or weak etc so if I'm up against strong air defence I loose.

I picked UK before realizing the 10% factor for sea, I would say I don't have a balanced force as I have very little ground units and some air mainly a lot of super hornets which seem to have crappy defense stats and get lost fequently.

I disagree with skunk on one thing, if I was a low level player I would buy gold units only a few and only enough to cover me off in terms of number I can use vs level and allies as they appearantly don't get killed off in fights. Then would have a few scouts for meat shielding and the rest medics or troop carriers. I'm talking maybe 3-5 allies max and from L1-19 after that point I think you had better have built up your defenses or be prepared for a cluster f....... as you level up. I don't think it makes sense to buy gold units once in the higher levels as their values won't account for as high a percentage of your total attack and defense scores. This seems to be the point at which lots of little guys are more important.

whocareswhatmynameis
12-09-2011, 08:44 AM
Popeye, the optimist in me says yes as I have a lot of scouts but as I look at my stats I seem to notice that at a certain point they don't add anything to my stats so building a 1000 doesn't make sense. For my level and number of allies I have just over 333. I have several hundred transports and medics. Have some high value attack units, but the mechanics of fighting make no sense to me. I can loose lots of scouts then suddenly a high valor unit, perhaps there is something factored into all units as some say strong or weak etc so if I'm up against strong air defence I loose.

I picked UK before realizing the 10% factor for sea, I would say I don't have a balanced force as I have very little ground units and some air mainly a lot of super hornets which seem to have crappy defense stats and get lost fequently.

I disagree with skunk on one thing, if I was a low level player I would buy gold units only a few and only enough to cover me off in terms of number I can use vs level and allies as they appearantly don't get killed off in fights. Then would have a few scouts for meat shielding and the rest medics or troop carriers. I'm talking maybe 3-5 allies max and from L1-19 after that point I think you had better have built up your defenses or be prepared for a cluster f....... as you level up. I don't think it makes sense to buy gold units once in the higher levels as their values won't account for as high a percentage of your total attack and defense scores. This seems to be the point at which lots of little guys are more important.

i think your observation is similar to my experience with CC. early on, gold players used to beat me successfully all the time. but as time went by, i was able to purchase weapons using respect points (MW lingo: valor). in addition, i farmed loot weapons, M4A1 in particular (is there an M4A1 equivalent in MW, i hope there is ;)). i am now able to defeat most gold players. so i agree- gold weapons are most effective at the beginning of the game. their power decreases as you progress up the higher levels.

Tramp Stamp
12-09-2011, 09:34 AM
gold weapons are most effective at the beginning of the game. their power decreases as you progress up the higher levels.

Oh their power remains the same, it's the price that goes up. Buying 5 low level gold units is a different league from buying 500 high power ones.

NeonBlue
12-09-2011, 04:10 PM
Wow, 197 wins already. Now I'm adding Transports just to be a jerk. Defense is up to 656. Somebody responded to my request for info as to what makes me a target with, "I attack u and I win". Promptly after he lost and gave me $423.

That's awesome :)

I just got my favorite wall post to date: "I am sorry for attacking you, I did not know you were strong."

Tramp Stamp
12-09-2011, 08:45 PM
I just got my favorite wall post to date: "I am sorry for attacking you, I did not know you were strong."

Most of the people posting codes on my wall are doing so immediately after losing.

I dumped all but 25 allies to see if it would affect the rate of attacks but I can't say it has. Up to 238 wins. Victories are starting to net large amounts of cash. The last four were $2696, $3255, $2428, and $1929. I guess by now basically no one can protect their money due to minuscule vaults. 35 exp to level 8.

bapesta206
12-09-2011, 08:50 PM
Is anyone on her paying for gold?

NeonBlue
12-09-2011, 11:41 PM
I dumped all but 25 allies to see if it would affect the rate of attacks but I can't say it has. Up to 238 wins.

Wow. I guess that means people seldom check out stats before attacking someone. I assume you don't get many repeat attackers, at least.

You may be leveling faster than expected, but it seems you are handling the leveling rate just fine.

Question: I know that who appears on your Rivals list (and what lists you appear on) depend on your level and number of allies. But does your total number of allies matter at all, or only the total used? (I.e., if i'm level 5 with 62 "potential" allies but of course only 25 in use, am I grouped with higher level rivals due to my unused 37 allies than I would be if I only had 25 in total?



I guess by now basically no one can protect their money due to minuscule vaults.

Oh, great point! I haven't adjusted from CC thinking, with the unlimited bank size. I kept wondering why people were so foolish as to attack me with their cash exposed. But of course they really have no choice, since it's fairly impossible for Vault size to keep up with income. (Thus making the Defensive Turtle an even more lucrative strategy in this game.)

Tramp Stamp
12-10-2011, 01:07 PM
Wow. I guess that means people seldom check out stats before attacking someone.

I figured. I mean why else would anyone attack me? If they actually checked the info they'd be insane to make an attempt. By shedding allies I was seeing if I could change class to a more conservative group of players that weren't so trigger happy, but if there's been a change in rate it's not noticeable. In fact, I almost want to argue that it has accelerated...


I assume you don't get many repeat attackers, at least.

Closest thing to it are people who attempt an attack and raid back-to-back. You'd think the people attempting raids would give pause and think about exactly how my base got so large and whether it was really worth attacking. I'm considering erecting a bunch of Guard Towers to see if they have some sort of scarecrow effect, but I want a few more expansions for the maneuverability breathing room.


You may be leveling faster than expected, but it seems you are handling the leveling rate just fine.

Yeah, I'm not concerned. The best of the rivals' stats rise steadily, but the bulk remain under 50 in both attack and defense. I can still easily take the stronger players if they chose to attack, but I doubt they'd do that when there are so many people around with stats reminiscent of five levels ago. If I do somehow get into trouble, a bailout is a Transport shopping spree away. And I can just start adding allies again.

Engineer attrition rate has really ramped up over the past two levels. I'm not sure if Funzio changed the formula, if there's a protection bonus granted at lower levels, or if the attackers are becoming proportionally stronger, but at this point I'd have to say that after level 4-5 they're not worth purchasing anymore. I'd still recommend the first 60 or so defense points coming from Engineers, but the player should move to Transports ASAP to maximize return.


But does your total number of allies matter at all, or only the total used?

That's hard to tell, but I think it only considers used. I don't think there are disadvantages to carrying more than what can be used, but I'm not certain, either.


I kept wondering why people were so foolish as to attack me with their cash exposed.

I'll bet they're not using their vaults anyway, I mean if they aren't even checking stats.


(Thus making the Defensive Turtle an even more lucrative strategy in this game.)

I think this strategy is close to the way to go. To speed things up one could forego construction of meaningless unit buildings and use the savings to pump out Frigates. I think it's hilarious that you can still rapidly rise in rank and power just from turtling, though.

downrange
12-10-2011, 06:54 PM
... and use the savings to pump out Frigates. I think it's hilarious that you can still rapidly rise in rank and power just from turtling, though.

I think you and I took only slightly diverging paths to get to about the same point. Seeing that you've settled on 26 allies feels somewhat validating. That's exactly where I ended up a day or two ago as well, albeit from the other direction. I built upward; as i had the money to buy 4 more transports I'd add another ally. Am pausing at this ally number since it maximizes that daily bonus (still meaningful even with my income) but slowly pushing my level up to 12 to get the next set of money buildings (all but a few are now upgraded to 4+).

I bought some frigates along the way, but stopped. I lost one in an attack and it stung a bit, especially relative to the payouts possible with my crop of rivals, so I adjusted. I decided that since most of my rivals have very little of value to poach and are so low on stats that I'd find a cheap unit with high-atk / low-def and max them out. I settled on the 3/1 Fighter Jet and bought enough to 'protect' my Transports, making it so no Transport ever comes into an offensive fight. The 2/1 Ranger would've worked too for a while, but I had cash to invest and preferred to attack from a higher advantage. I picked my victims^W rivals carefully, making sure to heavily favor those with very small incomes so there would be little chance they might respond and amass enough of an army to cause me any concern by the time I should be falling out of their news feed. Worked out fine, but the casualty rate still made the endeavor only slightly better than cash neutral, and coupled with the minor-but-not-zero risk of someone stepping their game up (or golding up) for revenge, I haven't attacked in a while. I'm going to echo what you said, it's funny that with such a defensive strategy I can decide on a whim to go attack/raid.

Neruid
12-11-2011, 03:08 PM
I've been sitting at lvl 13 now for over a week. The attacks have slowed and I'm starting to upgrade my money buildings. Money hasn't been an issue at all in terms of selecting upgrades / expanding / increasing vault size as I'm able to commence the next upgrade as soon as the last one finishes. I think in relation to the attacks most people start to learn to look at who they are attacking as they increase in level themselves and if they see high stats they steer clear. In that way turtling at a slightly higher lvl is working for me

I have lost a few more fights than you guy (all defending) as I chose to buy the base naval unit (2att/2def/very low loss rate) to make up the bulk of my army. I now have 200 of them.

Feel free to add me to look at my base / offer advice

Neruid 138 100 128

Tramp Stamp
12-11-2011, 04:02 PM
It's good to hear that attacks slow down as the Transport strategy won't scale forever. The main problem are unit building upgrade times rather than cash and that materially better units are multiple levels of upgrades away.

Nicz
12-12-2011, 01:49 PM
I'm now lvl 20, due to attacks, i havent lost fights, just some against gold players...
I'm at 65k income, with 200k vault. People attacking are rare, i just meet tards trying to when i have full vault.
800 atk/1600 def, i'm focused on fregates now, but i dont know what to buy after...
What advices can i have?

Tramp Stamp
12-12-2011, 05:41 PM
I got bored and shuffled my base around to squeeze in those "scarecrow" towers. I actually got every building encompassed by a tower and could probably get a couple more in near the Air Field so now everything has +2 defense. Ph33r me. What's interesting is that each tower adds to the total defense rating. I wonder if the figure is at all meaningful or, more likely, full of hot air.

http://i.imgur.com/qqOQa.png
http://i.imgur.com/rrg1c.png
http://i.imgur.com/eH9zZ.png

Nicz
12-13-2011, 01:25 AM
So u think that's important to get towers near each building?
For my part i build buildings with the idea to lose the minimum of space, and actually i dont have any towers :/
If u think that must be important, i'll have to expand at least 3 times to move my buildings already constructed...
Btw, i thought "omg 1.5 millions" but at lvl 8 u are secured with ur def stats, anyone attacking u loose; lvl 20 that's different, only gold players win against me.
(Sorry if i did english mistakes, i'm french ^^)

Agent Orange
12-13-2011, 04:58 AM
I also think it's important to use the defensive buildings though there appears to be no hard data to support it.

For the tower person, can I make a suggestion so you can maximize their defensive potential. Put them together and place your money buildings around them. When you click on the towers you will see a blue halo around surrounding buildings, that is the towers defensive range. Therefore you can maximize their defensive potential by taking advantage of their circular defense..... I use a lot of Sams they have more defensive range as seen by their halos so I can overlap overtop of more money units.

How did you get your pix to show up inside the message? Are they links to an external site? I tried doing that the other day but uploading to the forum just puts a link in my message and not the image.

Tramp Stamp
12-13-2011, 08:30 AM
Haha, don't get me wrong, I basically built the towers as a joke. They offer 2 def compared to the 656 I had before constructing them. I can't see how they would make any meaningful tactical difference. I don't recommend building them unless you also are bored.


Btw, i thought "omg 1.5 millions" but at lvl 8 u are secured with ur def stats, anyone attacking u loose; lvl 20 that's different, only gold players win against me.

I won all of those 364 battles in a row. Even a gold player who spent $20 would probably have difficulty defeating me.


For the tower person, can I make a suggestion so you can maximize their defensive potential. Put them together and place your money buildings around them.

Are you talking to me? If so, every building in the base is covered, not just the money buildings. Are you suggesting there's a cumulative effect in stacking? If so I'm not seeing the data supporting that.


How did you get your pix to show up inside the message? Are they links to an external site?

I used imgur. I also resized them to 640 px width. Any wider forces horizontal scrolling in the forum.

Agent Orange
12-13-2011, 08:43 AM
Yes, I don't have data to support it but overlapping seems to work. Ganted we don't even know what kind of bump just a single building produces.

Tramp Stamp
12-13-2011, 12:10 PM
Not a single attack in over 24 hours.

looker
12-13-2011, 02:09 PM
Seems attacks in general have slowed.. holidays or people bored, or something.

Agent Orange
12-13-2011, 02:25 PM
Here's a shot of my base. I overlap as much as possible with the turrets and sams. Thanks for the help with the pix too!

I'll probably rejig my base in a while to maximize coverage for some new stuff I'm building.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7026/6507429851_b05c5aba19_z.jpg

NeonBlue
12-13-2011, 03:35 PM
I'm level 7 now and getting attacked fairly regularly - 25 in the last 24 hours. One interesting note, where I used to often get around 2k from an attacker (or nothing), all my cash-bearing attackers for the last day have gifted me in the hundreds rather than thousands. Not enough data yet to know if it's just a combination of poorer attackers and increased vault usage, or if there's been some change to the mechanic of how much cash an attacker can lose to a successful defender.

It's gotten to the point where I feel a bit ripped off if someone attacks me and leaves less than $1000 behind Hmm...what's that, "turtle entitlement disorder"?

And in terms of units, I've lost 3 engineers (and no transports) in 187 fights; two of the lost engineers were announced on the SitRep, but I saw no mention of the latest casualty.


My ultra-turtle is plugging along quietly, but as long as my semi-turtle can keep acquiring defense and successfully warding off attacks, it seems like a more prosperous strategy, since it has access to more money buildings and will pull away pretty quickly in terms of stockpiling funds.

jlhy
12-13-2011, 04:57 PM
Just curious if any other campers are noticing higher levels visiting their bases. I leave my ID on my wall so people can join if they want to. Today I got 3 adds and their levels were 21, 18, and 17. I received these invites within the past 4 hours. My character is level 10 and has 76 allies.

Agent Orange
12-13-2011, 05:27 PM
Sounds like TED's all right.

I just noticed something in my rivals list. Someone who is a Level 40 with 347 allies but only 321 attack and 268 defense. Not good considering most of us are well over 10k in attack and defense.

Agent Orange
12-13-2011, 05:33 PM
Hmm someone else popped into my rivals list who is a L39 with 199 allies, 1042 attack and 933 defense. Are they screwed or what.

Tramp Stamp
12-14-2011, 09:11 PM
Been something like 60 hours and not a single attack.

NeonBlue
12-14-2011, 11:14 PM
Been something like 60 hours and not a single attack.

That's so strange! Maybe with your particular level/allies combo, you fell into a sweet spot? (Or sour spot, depending on how much you were enjoying the cash gifts your attackers were leaving you...)

I'm at 7/35, and attacks are still coming in regularly, averaging just over one/hour.

Are you considering bulking up on allies again, to see if that puts you back in the action? Or are you enjoying this pacifistic interlude?

NeonBlue
12-14-2011, 11:21 PM
I though of spelling something, but all squares need to be attached on the sides.. then I got bored.

Well dang it, you just blew my latest theory, looker. I was SURE you'd drawn a turtle -- and I was stunned at the self-referential cleverness of that choice. (He was crawling up and right, out of the water.) But now it either never was a turtle, or its front legs have grown abnormally long.

Tramp Stamp
12-14-2011, 11:45 PM
I'm torn! I was kind of counting on 2-3 attacks per hour to steadily raise my level and keep things interesting. As a compromise, I finally built the War Factory, which gave me 22 exp. I think doing that unlocked an instantly completed goal because I got some exp and cash for meeting some "war funds" amount. I reached $3,000,000 at just about that point so maybe that was it. Now I'll build some decorations as that is a goal, which will push me up a level. I already have the 8 gold tree as I was tired of lag-clicking construction completions.

If pruning my allies list had an effect, there must have been a several hour kick-in period because attacks were still coming in steadily, even faster, at first.

My mid-term plan is to do the money building thing and work my way to level 4 Dry Docks. From there I'll purchase a bunch of Aircraft Carriers (27/46) at $5.4 mil a piece. Its 27 attack might be enough to not worry about offense. If so I might just plow my way up to level 200 from there. If not I'll tack on some marginally more expensive Railgun Destroyers. If I acquire no more money buildings, level 10 of what I have will allow me to buy about one Aircraft Carrier per day. In all likelihood I'll actively seek new money buildings at some point.

Edit: haha, the goal after decorations is to collect from a Supply Depot 5 times. Sure, no problem.

NeonBlue
12-15-2011, 12:06 AM
As a compromise, I finally built the War Factory, which gave me 22 exp.

I've been debating doing just that. But I feared exactly what happened to you, that it would trigger other building goals and I'd lose control, a bit, over my leveling speed. I'm tempted to force-level a few levels, just to open up some new money buildings, and if I do I'll likely do missions to earn the xp, and still leave the War Factory goal as a blocker.

I'm curious -- why would you consider not adding any available money buildings? It seems like free money, since my new-building cooldown often goes unused. It's a way of adding to my hourly income without using up any of my precious upgrade-building cooldown. Is there some downside? Or do you just like a small and efficient base, with fewer click-click-clicks to make?

Tramp Stamp
12-15-2011, 12:22 AM
I'm curious -- why would you consider not adding any available money buildings?

I wouldn't. I simply have nothing left to build at all. No money buildings, no unit buildings, no defense buildings. Well, except the gold ones.

looker
12-15-2011, 03:21 PM
I've realize I need to be at lvl 3 instead of 2 to get some better buildings (Munitions Stockpile). But wondering what the attack impact will be/

Winning
12-16-2011, 11:16 AM
is there a way to sell units when your done with them?

907 925 966

duder
12-16-2011, 11:46 AM
@Tramp Stamp


From there I'll purchase a bunch of Aircraft Carriers (27/46) at $5.4 mil a piece. Its 27 attack might be enough to not worry about offense.

I really wish I'd picked UK instead of US (sigh). An extra 10% on those stats? Yes please?

Tramp Stamp
12-16-2011, 11:59 AM
Me, too. Without information I was trying to estimate which one Funzio would make better. I picked Russia and lost.

looker
12-16-2011, 02:54 PM
Me, too. Without information I was trying to estimate which one Funzio would make better. I picked Russia and lost.

Same boat here... they should really have an option to choose your country later as you get a feel for the game. But I guess the fix can be solved with 50 gold :(

Dover
12-19-2011, 09:25 AM
I'm torn! I was kind of counting on 2-3 attacks per hour to steadily raise my level and keep things interesting. As a compromise, I finally built the War Factory, which gave me 22 exp. I think doing that unlocked an instantly completed goal because I got some exp and cash for meeting some "war funds" amount. I reached $3,000,000 at just about that point so maybe that was it. Now I'll build some decorations as that is a goal, which will push me up a level. I already have the 8 gold tree as I was tired of lag-clicking construction completions.

If pruning my allies list had an effect, there must have been a several hour kick-in period because attacks were still coming in steadily, even faster, at first.

My mid-term plan is to do the money building thing and work my way to level 4 Dry Docks. From there I'll purchase a bunch of Aircraft Carriers (27/46) at $5.4 mil a piece. Its 27 attack might be enough to not worry about offense. If so I might just plow my way up to level 200 from there. If not I'll tack on some marginally more expensive Railgun Destroyers. If I acquire no more money buildings, level 10 of what I have will allow me to buy about one Aircraft Carrier per day. In all likelihood I'll actively seek new money buildings at some point.

Edit: haha, the goal after decorations is to collect from a Supply Depot 5 times. Sure, no problem.

This is a bump and request to sticky this whole thread (though I came here for this post). I have read most of the useful posts in this forum but I sometimes forget where I read something when I get to that level. Would be nice and we could cut down on duplicate posts if we could get a few sticky posts that people could read along the way like "What to know before you begin playing", "Opening Moves- the first 20 levels", "Whats Next - Levels 21-XX", something like that.

Nicz
12-20-2011, 04:20 AM
That's exactly the reason why i wrote a thread "some advices for turtle strategy" which could be translated on "some advices for 20th level and after".
Stamp we need you, you're turtle god ^^

CoachPappy
12-21-2011, 08:39 AM
When following this advice when do you advance to the next level. My 2nd account that I started after reading this thread is level 3 and undefeated against attacks/raids. I have built every money building possible. In a couple more upgrades every building will be at level 3. When do I start building the unit buildings and when is it advantageous to advance a level?

Tramp Stamp
12-21-2011, 09:15 AM
I'd say you should outclass rivals by at least 2:1 to avoid being eaten alive by attrition. Beyond 3x is probably overkill.

CoachPappy
12-21-2011, 10:44 AM
What about buying units. Is there any advantage to being diverse, or should I stick to engineers and transports?

Dover
12-21-2011, 10:52 AM
I believe valor units are the only one that have a benefit against other certain units. For Def engineers and transports are the way to build it. Eng's at lower level and transports when you start getting more money on a regular basis. If you are Rus or UK you could buy more of that unit for the bonus.

emcee
01-08-2012, 08:39 PM
Regarding ultra turtling tactics here's my experience.

Currently level 3 playing for about a month now. Fights won 5. Fights lost 0. Defense 59. The last time someone has attacked me was 23 days ago. The first attack was 34 days ago. As I mentioned in my tortoise guide do not add even 1 alliance member. The MW game mechanics automatically puts you in a different bracket and will subject you to attacks. My current income is 100375/hour with all income buildings minimum level 6.

Someone posted about having no defense at being level 2 so will never win any attacks and get bumped to level 3. I would suggest anyone with this approach to dump all allies and buy the best possible defense units. Feel free to buy all other buildings but don't worry about leveling them up until all income buildings are at level 10. In the meantime expand the base and upgrade vault.

My friends account employing the same method but adding allies got bumped to level 5. His current stats is Fights won 40, fights lost 3, alliance members 1, income 94108 and defense 87. Last attack was 20 days ago. First attack was 36 days ago.

From both accounts you can see there is no need to invest in numerous units to beef up defense scores. Just buy enough to max defense for 1 alliance and that's it.

With respect to guard towers in my friends account set up income buildings in a rectangular formation and have them side by side with all income buildings circling around. At level 5 all you need is 4 towers to cover all income producing units. Place you best income units in the middle as the towers have a multiplying effect based on their range coverage. Supply depot and armories should be placed at the corners.

Frankly I don't even think defense buildings are even necessary as alliance overall has the greatest impact on attacks. However, it doesn't hurt to cover all bases especially with lots of income sitting around.

It's nice to have alliance members to see other bases but in MW drop all allies if you want to have the optimum turtling strategy.

Tramp Stamp
01-08-2012, 09:55 PM
I am also in this attack dead zone as no one has even made an attempt in nearly a month. I can't say what exactly triggered it, though it wasn't too long after consolidating allies but long enough after where I can't definitively say.

As for defensive structures, I construct them just to have something to do and work towards the 75 buildings goal.

Wildfire
01-09-2012, 04:01 AM
emcee and Tramp Stamp I wish I had your patience, to play a war game in a way where you basically do nothing but build for months on end is quite something! I've tried slowing down but I can't resist the urge to do things when I see the energy and stamina bars sitting full!

So after a month I'm just about to hit level 50, looking at my allies and rivals and ignoring those who've had a large gold spend, I'm sitting in the top third in economy and defence terms but tend to need to cherry pick who to attack as I'm weaker on that side. Despite always having buildings upgrading I've nothing above level 6 and many still at level 1,but I've got here relatively ok.

Looking ahead if the people in my allies list in the 60s and 70s are anything to go by it will get really difficult, I can see how much better I'd be placed I'd be if I was getting here, as you will be, with my buildings already upgraded rather than trying to do it as I go along. I think your strategy will work at least as far ahead as I can see.

In a way for me it kind of emphasises the main flaw in this game, the best way to play it over a long term seems basically to be to do virtually nothing for months on end till you get established. I wish you could have multiple accounts, I'd like to try a slowly slowly one alongside my current one!

Dover
01-09-2012, 05:02 AM
I agree with Wildfire. I sat at 20 for about 2 weeks and then could not resist questing when my energy was full. I am now at 30 and I am trying my best not to hit 32 for another 2 weeks while a few non money buildings get leveled. Most of my money buildings are now at the point where they are 30-60 hours to grow or the ROI is now good enough to spend 2.8 mil to upgrade.

Anyone know how long or how much a Level 6 shipyard takes to build or buy? I would like to spend a few valor points but I am only upgrading the shipyard to L2 today.

Wildfire
01-09-2012, 05:32 AM
Ok here's a completely different strategy for a laugh!
As an example Level 50 is 41625 experience points

On the insurgent camp you get 2 experience points each time you hit on the Insurgent Leader, you don't need any units just 15 energy, so you can hit on him regardless of how weak you are. Pile all skill points into energy so that it doesn't sit full ever.

so 41625/2 = 20813 hits on him

20813*15 =312195 units of energy

312195/3= 104065 minutes =1734.42 hours = 72 days or 7 days quicker if you choose Iran

and you'll have got 20813 Desert Leaders along the way 1 attack 1 defence

so if the allies cap was lifted you could in 72 days be at level 50 with an empty base but an attack and defence strength of 20813, in practice you'd be 1000 attack 1000 defence which won't do much good.

Now couple that with building your base as you go, it doesn't matter if you get raided or attacked as long as you manage to keep enough in the vault to build your next building.

There are probably alternatives to this using Light Gunners instead as they are not used in defence, maybe some of them give a better cash return as well as experience points.

Anybody know the experience points for level 200, till we see how long that would take?

Agent Orange
01-09-2012, 08:03 AM
Exp pts are always 3 per level up if that's what you mean, otherwise 3 x 200 = 600 x 10 = 6000 plus whatever you started with which I don't remember.

FYI iPod touches were cheap over the holidays.... might be cheaper than buying gold. ;^)

I bought one but haven't had time to set it up. I think I would try the turtle strategy as leveling up too fast is a recipe for disaster. The rivals listings keep getting tweeked and they are better but once you hit a certain point you are basically still screwed. That point keeps changing and it could be a function of how many other players are making it to this point.

Things I would do to minimize attacks/losses.

- level up your vault as fast as you can!
- do not add too many allies
- attacking/raiding in the higher levels (over 60?) is very expensive even when your rival is much lower
- I don't keep a lot of cash in my vault over night, reason being even though it is in the vault there are a lot of high level players looking for an easy score so they will hit you once just to see if you have unprotected cash.
- I've started to take all my skill pts as energy in order to farm the map missions not complete them all but to replay specific ones that give me good cash.
- I buy defense buildings but use the circle your wagons strategy with defense in the middle surrounded by money buildings and leaving the unit buildings unprotected. I also overlap coverage and have since I started to play as this does seem to increase my defense. There is a point when your attacker will overwhelm your defense though.
- Have a more balanced defense in terms of units, mainly though sea and air since most folks are grabbing the Super Hornet (air) and Stealth Frigates (sea) with valor.
- Plan your construction of money buildings so they become 'ripe' when you can 'harvest' them otherwise they go ready overnight when the whales can come and poach you.

So if I was going to restart the game I would do what TS suggests plus only build unit buildings and level the crap out of them. Not sure about the money buildings only because they make you a target but if nobody wants you as a target then I suppose building them makes a lot of sense. But at some point you will need them once you start to level up.

Guess I really need to crack that iPod soon to test some of this....

Dover
01-09-2012, 08:29 AM
Is it worth doing the pvp quests and adding more allies in one controled day to accumulate all the valor you can and then remove the allies to bring you down to the lower group again? Are there quests that give out valor?

Agent Orange
01-09-2012, 08:34 AM
No valor seems to only come from attacking/raiding. But you can save your ally requests. There was a report of a bug if you try and accept more than 100 at a time though.

Wildfire
01-09-2012, 09:50 AM
Exp pts are always 3 per level up if that's what you mean, otherwise 3 x 200 = 600 x 10 = 6000 plus whatever you started with which I don't remember.

FYI iPod touches were cheap over the holidays.... might be cheaper than buying gold. ;^)


No what I meant was the number someone at level 199 would see when they click on their score in the top right hand corner of your screen, I mean the total yellow star XP points that the player would have collected to reach level 200.

Funny I was thinking just the same thing about an ipod touch, my son plays on one and it looks tiny on screen compared to an ipad, much more sluggish too and crashes a lot more but his is not the current generation so that might be why. I'd noticed them cheaper here to and was thinking can I justify one just to play a game, never thought of the "it's cheaper than gold" angle!

Agent Orange
01-09-2012, 11:57 AM
Oh ok, I get it now. Not sure, I'm at L74 and it says I will hit L75 when I reach 110205 experience. When I hit 100 I guess it would be double. I polled my brothers and here's what they said.

L75 = 110205
L56 = 54510
L50 = 41625

I have a feeling that the gaps increase as you move up but not sure never thought to track that information but maybe others can log into the thread and add their numbers so we can form a list.

Dover
01-09-2012, 12:08 PM
Oh ok, I get it now. Not sure, I'm at L74 and it says I will hit L75 when I reach 110205 experience. When I hit 100 I guess it would be double. I polled my brothers and here's what they said.

L75 = 110205
L56 = 54510
L50 = 41625

I have a feeling that the gaps increase as you move up but not sure never thought to track that information but maybe others can log into the thread and add their numbers so we can form a list.

Can we add it to Tramps spreadsheet for building times? The spreadsheet could probably be renamed for all the difffernt types of info it will hold. We just need to make a new tab. Once we get another numbers in there we could almost forcast out the rest of the ones we need.

scp33
01-09-2012, 12:21 PM
So...then if one hasn;t followed this strategy from the beginning is there any hope to "catch up" so to speak? I'm currently at level 40, have 360 allies and pathetic attack and defense scores. Like 1000a/1000d and can't seem to gain any ground from being attached overnight and losing units. Thoughts? Or blow the whole thing up and start over?

Agent Orange
01-09-2012, 12:49 PM
So...then if one hasn;t followed this strategy from the beginning is there any hope to "catch up" so to speak? I'm currently at level 40, have 360 allies and pathetic attack and defense scores. Like 1000a/1000d and can't seem to gain any ground from being attached overnight and losing units. Thoughts? Or blow the whole thing up and start over?

I suspect it will greatly depend on what your strategy was to start with but at L40 with only 1000a/d you're kind of screwed. Especially with the high ally count.

If you are being raided over night and loosing a lot on big money buildings you can try and get them to become ready at a time when you are online. The best way was to build them based on how long they take to come due and then start building them so that they are built at a specific time which the game tells you. Then work out from that time how long it takes for the building to fill. Now see if that fits into your sked. If not do then rejig when you start the process.

If you have buildings already established you can do upgrades as they will take specific times. So do an upgrade but only start it after calculating backwards to see when the best times are for you to collect their cash.

Also make sure you have been upgrading your vault. My feeling now is that you should start to upgrade the minute you start to play and to keep upgrading as you play.

I like the idea of starting over but it really depends on how you are currently set up. I've been helping my brothers get out from under their respective situations and at first I thought to tell them to start over but as the game has started to fill up with players they aren't being hit up as much. Plus the fact that I might pay some of their attackers a visit if I'm more powerful...

If you don't I would concentrate on defense both on base and overall in your stats and this will depend a lot on what you have already done.

scp33
01-09-2012, 01:08 PM
appreciate the help. Feel free to take a look at my base if you want, if that would help you make a better assessment. My vault is currently as 500k for what its worth. My ID is Jonas: 141 973 910

So would it be a good idea to shed some allies? Also, should i employ the "camping approach" and stop leveling up while I try to reinforce?

Agent Orange
01-09-2012, 01:50 PM
appreciate the help. Feel free to take a look at my base if you want, if that would help you make a better assessment. My vault is currently as 500k for what its worth. My ID is Jonas: 141 973 910

So would it be a good idea to shed some allies? Also, should i employ the "camping approach" and stop leveling up while I try to reinforce?

I might not be able to see you in my rival list. I don't recognize the name.

500k vault, that might be something I would upgrade soon.

scp33
01-09-2012, 02:00 PM
tecnically you could add me...then vistit my base then delete me as an ally if you wanted. Couldnt you? No worries if you don't want to take the time. I appreciate the insight.

Wildfire
01-09-2012, 02:15 PM
So...then if one hasn;t followed this strategy from the beginning is there any hope to "catch up" so to speak? I'm currently at level 40, have 360 allies and pathetic attack and defense scores. Like 1000a/1000d and can't seem to gain any ground from being attached overnight and losing units. Thoughts? Or blow the whole thing up and start over?

I'd try fighting my way out for a bit, it's good experience if nothing else, in conjunction with what Agent Orange suggests this is what I'd try.

Ditch hundreds of allies, I'd go right down to the 200 max that level 40 supports as a starter, maybe even lower to about 150. If you haven't been expanding your vault get it going now. Be there when your most productive money buildings are ready to collect from and put it straight into the vault. When the vault is full start buying good defensive units, transports or something like that. Getting more good defensive units by loot farming could help too, as well as bringing in some cash. Don't do other PVE missions as you tend to need units that are lost straight away if you are attacked. At night or whenever you're away for hours spend your vault cash on more transports etc. I think if you can get the defence up to about 1500-1600 people will give you an easier time as they'll find softer targets.

I'm not sure if having your max number of allies helps unless you have lots of strong units, as a rule of thumb I've tended to keep mine down to a level where every defence unit I use is 4-6 strength minimum. I suspect more allies still increases your visibility to rivals to some extent.

If it works and people are leaving you alone, consolidate your position, look at your rivals and keep building you defence until it's better than most you see, bringing in more allies if need be if you're dropped way below your maximum. Your attack will probably be quite weak but you will be progressing regardless, loot farming alone will rank you up, you can start increasing you attack once your economy is working again, it is the lowest priority.

good luck

scp33
01-09-2012, 02:33 PM
Thanks Wildfire. I really appreciate the insight! I will regroup and see what I can do! Today all I've done is loot farm on the two first maps with the insurgent leader and the aircraft carrier! Good luck to you as well!

Wildfire
01-09-2012, 02:46 PM
Oh ok, I get it now. Not sure, I'm at L74 and it says I will hit L75 when I reach 110205 experience. When I hit 100 I guess it would be double. I polled my brothers and here's what they said.

L75 = 110205
L56 = 54510
L50 = 41625

I have a feeling that the gaps increase as you move up but not sure never thought to track that information but maybe others can log into the thread and add their numbers so we can form a list.

Yes the gaps go up each level, looks like the same sort of % increase each time. Using the strategy of just hitting on the Insurgent Leader would take 191 days then to get to level 75! You'd have over 50,000 Desert Leaders too! Or you could probably use an enormous quantity of gold to keep refilling the energy and go 1 - 200 in less than a day!

Tramp Stamp
01-09-2012, 06:15 PM
Can we add it to Tramps spreadsheet for building times? The spreadsheet could probably be renamed for all the difffernt types of info it will hold. We just need to make a new tab. Once we get another numbers in there we could almost forcast out the rest of the ones we need.

Feel free. I'll intervene if it gets totally trashed but the spreadsheet has taken on a life of its own, so I try to be hands off in terms of what people are doing to it.

Firefoxx
08-27-2012, 07:32 PM
Hello...

I'm trying to find if anyone has created a chart for the different buildings, their prices, their payouts at various levels, (ie, ROI) and the different targets for the various maps and missions.

I had thought about doing this myself, but as of yet I'm only level 33 on MW, and I'm not a gold buyer at all. I refuse, actually, to spend REAL WORLD funds on in-game anything.

Also, I just now a few minutes ago figured out how to get the little arrows that show up over un-hit targets to appear and disappear but I was going to ask how to make the "list" of targets show up! I could have saved so much time and effort and brain strain if that had been turned on!

Thanks for the great post, and I'm going to continue to read up!

Zach
A.K.A. "Firefoxx"

(Firefoxx since June, 1994)

joaquim
08-27-2012, 07:42 PM
Look for the buildings spreadsheet.
Next time don't necro the the thread as it is against the posting guidelines and is a bannable offense.

ModernCamper
01-13-2013, 09:54 PM
Thanks.Good

ohgreatitsryan
01-13-2013, 10:27 PM
Return of the phantom thread!

waterdog87
01-30-2013, 10:11 PM
nation selection

uk (sea power) is probably the best end game option while china (infantry) would be the best upfront. Germany (ground forces) and russia (air) would appear to be in the middle but are probably suboptimal options as sea units aren't significantly more expensive, if at all, and have the benefit of being more durable. I'd like to hear contrasting opinions. There's not much discussion on the topic, and i'm more of an authority on economics than pvp strategy.

starter gold usage

you technically are not forced to expend gold during the tutorial. While the menu is locked, the timer is still active. Don't beat yourself up if you paid as there isn't anything one can do with the default 10 gold besides speeding up building (or buying a red maple tree). Gold usage for speeding up is max(int(minutes_remaining/12),1). Int() is the integer, or truncate, function, which means to chop off any decimal for a hard round down. For example, 24 minutes, 0 seconds will consume 2 gold (24/12 = 2) while 23 minutes, 59 seconds (23.983333 minutes) divided by 12 is 1.9986. Chop off the decimal and you'll end up at 1. Therefore, for maximum return on initial gold, use it to complete 10 buildings/upgrades with less than 24 minutes remaining. The earlier you use up the gold, the better, in terms of roi. The max() function guarantees expenditure of at least one gold piece, even if there remains only one second of build time.

money building spreadsheet

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0agehrvnoijxudg1nafdaqup5qlowt0rqs1z2bll6z ue&hl=en_us&pli=1#gid=4

getting started

build the barracks as instructed then immediately upgrade it to level 2, which will take an hour. Meanwhile, build two of each money building starting from the least expensive and trigger a land expansion as you will rapidly run out of space. Next, you'll need to get 25 allies onto your list in order to get the $1,000 visitor bonus from each. There aren't (yet) organized resources like there are for crime city. I suggest harvesting this forum then browsing the comments of the users who accept. App store reviews are another source. You shouldn't have a problem with getting to 25 in less than an hour, two tops, if you just keep adding numbers while the total is under 25. Make sure to actually visit them to get the bonus. As you collect, take the opportunity to practice using the "vault" option as it is not automatic. Coachpappy suggests dumping all 10 gold into the vip system, which will free the player to manage his base and visit automatically added allies. Most likely you will still need to add a healthy amount manually, however.

Once the barracks finishes upgrading, immediately upgrade one of the supply depots, which will cost $1,670. It finishes in 6 minutes. Now mentally set aside $1,670 to upgrade the other supply depot and $2,790 to upgrade one to level 3, which takes 30 minutes. With the supply depot upgrade in motion and funds earmarked for the next ~40 minutes of upgrades, dump all your remaining cash into engineers. Don't be shy. The 5-7 you'll be able to afford right now will adequately protect you from level 2 attackers, but they come fast in this game.

Soon you'll be rolling in cash. Your income per hour will exceed $13,000 after a little more than two hours invested. You'll get a significant amount of supplemental income by defending against attacks from players who forgot to vault their money. Next upgrades are the other supply depot to level 3, armories to level 3, storage silos to level 3, supply depots to level 4. Keep packing on the engineers. You'll want a minimum of 2x defense to your top rival's attack. Then up that to 3x to give the middle finger to the constant wave of attackers. Don't worry about the high casualty ranking. With so many engineers you'll totally overrun the opposition and keep them all. 15 engineers is a good starter amount for levels 2-4, but with the constant wave of attacks you may level up when not paying attention so it helps to be prepared. After 15 engineers it is recommended to switch to transports. Modern war allows five allies per level and four units per ally. Worked out, that means up to 20 units at level 1, 40 at level 2, 60 at level 3 and so on.

Once you've set up base camp, so to speak, it's up to you. You have a lot of breathing room as long as you avoid pvp, questing, and goal accomplishment. Fortunately the war factory isn't awfully useful in the early going, as it is a goal. The rest is wide open, though. I suggest proceeding in this order: Always be upgrading money buildings, expand territory to fit all the available money buildings then construct them, add to the vault max, add more land to fit unit buildings then construct them. Remember to build new money buildings as your level is forced higher due to defending attacks. Stockpile powerful units until satisfied then move on.

Note that game mechanics have changed significantly since this guide was created so some items may no longer apply.

alot of good info, i'm trying to get my ten reply s in so i can start a new thread

waterdog87
01-30-2013, 10:13 PM
i should note that, at least with levels 1-4, the rivals list is a slop bucket where people with 2 allies comingle with guys with 15 so i don't think adding allies early makes a difference. This could easily change if this game picks up and becomes more popular and/or more people adopt strategies like what was outlined here.

alot of good info, i'm trying to get my ten reply s in so i can start a new thread

joshdavidson12345
02-01-2013, 03:00 AM
Totally agree about the vault. One of my earliest goals was to be capable of supporting all three types of upgrades at all times: Buildings, Vault, Expansion.Generating the money for those is not a problem, but holding the money needed for all three types was slightly problematic for me with my no-allies path - this should be considered a factor in favor of Tramp Stamp's recommendation. Eventually the vault had grown and the various upgrade times get so long that there's little overlap. Time is the limiting factor from very early on, and looks to be that way as far out as I can see. ALWAYS be upgrading all three, regardless of need.I was fortunate enough to know what I was doing when I started(thanks to the VF's). And within the first hour I was on 13k iph. Then by around level 7 10 I went over 100k. Now I'm on 318k. But what I wanted to say is that if you're camping under level 11 and an expansion costs 10 mil at the moment, f not for my AC one cannot constantly ALWAYS be doing all 3 . Unless you have endless supplies of gold. But i still very rarely lose. Maybe once every 3 months.( minister can correct me). Still camping but can't wait to reach the higher levels with bigger buildings:) Good luck to all camping. Stay strong and stand firm! VFF Camps & Tramps

heal
03-08-2013, 03:18 PM
I've recently started again, this time on my android phone and have been using a lot of the tips in this thread. I decided not to get the money buildings where I would need to be constantly collected, and I currently have 2x munition stockpiles (level 3), 2x military market (level 1) and a communications centre. My vault will be at 75k in 6 hours. I have 1 ally who plays on the ipod ;)

I am upto level 6 thanks to some who have attacked me and others who I couldn't resist doing a little raid. I try not to keep too much money in my vault, and if I cant build or upgrade building or the vault with my money, I expand my base. I can't be bother buying units at the moment, and have a attack of 110 and defence of 113. I haven't lost a fight yet but I'm sure someone will see me and get tempted. I recently decided that I was having to wait too long for cash and wanted one cash building that would regularly supply me (but not too regularly) so I've just built a wind farm. I don't really care if I get attacked and lose, it won't be worth the effort of the attacker.

Tha General
04-24-2013, 07:07 PM
I know the bonuses dont just add together. And i had read somewhere in the forum before that there was an equation to calculate your total bonuses when adding them. For instance a 10% bonus and 3% bonus dont add to 13%. Such as how the first 3 health regeneration bonuses add to 14% enstead of 15. Help would be greatly appreciated.

MerlinBlack
04-24-2013, 07:09 PM
http://community.us.playstation.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/79155i873F7A9A5F7D6850/image-size/original?v=mpbl-1&px=-1
Behold! The resurrection!

Burnt
04-24-2013, 08:17 PM
http://community.us.playstation.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/79155i873F7A9A5F7D6850/image-size/original?v=mpbl-1&px=-1
Behold! The resurrection!

Good stuff...

Vandslaux
06-03-2013, 02:34 PM
Thank god i saw this right now while im lv 8, with about 450 attack and, after now buying engineers to a. Boost my defense, and b. dump gold, 500 defense.

Have I ruined my game?

Jman
06-03-2013, 07:31 PM
Thank god i saw this right now while im lv 8, with about 450 attack and, after now buying engineers to a. Boost my defense, and b. dump gold, 500 defense.

Have I ruined my game?

You could be worse. Nice necro, by the way.

Tramp Stamp
10-29-2013, 12:27 PM
Hello Modern War community. I have returned to remove the link to what is undoubtedly a hilariously out of date version of one of the early Modern War spreadsheets. Iím guessing that the document became inaccessible during the transition to Google Drive. Ever since then I have been getting sporadic Google-generated requests to share the document. However, within the past two weeks or so the frequency of requests has increased dramatically so I decided to invest the time to figure out where they were coming from. As my old base building topic is linked through a sticky post, Iím assuming that is the point of entry. My apologies for any inconvenience, though at this point itís probably for the best as the spreadsheet was probably still based on a January 2012 data dump.

To new readers who are wondering where to go, I havenít read much of the conversation, but from what I can tell, Maverick picked up the torch in my absence, and since then an iOS app called ďToolkit for Modern WarĒ has been built around the collective capital.

Norseman
10-29-2013, 05:27 PM
EDIT 2013-10-29

I wrote this guide a few days after Modern Warís late November 2011 release. As such, it is likely significantly out of date when factoring hindsight and game changes over a two year span. Please verify information herein with contemporary forum posters. Please do not direct inquiries at me as I retired from the game as of February 2012 and am not privy to any activities since that time. See this post (http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?13937-Suggested-opening-moves-for-an-economy-base&p=1050735&viewfull=1#post1050735) for comments.

Nation selection

UK (Sea Power) is probably the best end game option while China (Infantry) would be the best upfront. Germany (Ground Forces) and Russia (Air) would appear to be in the middle but are probably suboptimal options as sea units aren't significantly more expensive, if at all, and have the benefit of being more durable. I'd like to hear contrasting opinions. There's not much discussion on the topic, and I'm more of an authority on economics than PvP strategy.

Starter gold usage

You technically are not forced to expend gold during the tutorial. While the menu is locked, the timer is still active. Don't beat yourself up if you paid as there isn't anything one can do with the default 10 gold besides speeding up building (or buying a red maple tree). Gold usage for speeding up is max(int(minutes_remaining/12),1). Int() is the integer, or truncate, function, which means to chop off any decimal for a hard round down. For example, 24 minutes, 0 seconds will consume 2 gold (24/12 = 2) while 23 minutes, 59 seconds (23.983333 minutes) divided by 12 is 1.9986. Chop off the decimal and you'll end up at 1. Therefore, for maximum return on initial gold, use it to complete 10 buildings/upgrades with less than 24 minutes remaining. The earlier you use up the gold, the better, in terms of ROI. The max() function guarantees expenditure of at least one gold piece, even if there remains only one second of build time.

Money Building Spreadsheet

<link removed>

Getting started

Build the Barracks as instructed then immediately upgrade it to level 2, which will take an hour. Meanwhile, build two of each money building starting from the least expensive and trigger a land expansion as you will rapidly run out of space. Next, you'll need to get 25 allies onto your list in order to get the $1,000 visitor bonus from each. There aren't (yet) organized resources like there are for Crime City. I suggest harvesting this forum then browsing the comments of the users who accept. App Store reviews are another source. You shouldn't have a problem with getting to 25 in less than an hour, two tops, if you just keep adding numbers while the total is under 25. Make sure to actually visit them to get the bonus. As you collect, take the opportunity to practice using the "Vault" option as it is not automatic. CoachPappy suggests dumping all 10 gold into the VIP system, which will free the player to manage his base and visit automatically added allies. Most likely you will still need to add a healthy amount manually, however.

Once the Barracks finishes upgrading, immediately upgrade one of the Supply Depots, which will cost $1,670. It finishes in 6 minutes. Now mentally set aside $1,670 to upgrade the other Supply Depot and $2,790 to upgrade one to level 3, which takes 30 minutes. With the Supply Depot upgrade in motion and funds earmarked for the next ~40 minutes of upgrades, dump all your remaining cash into Engineers. Don't be shy. The 5-7 you'll be able to afford right now will adequately protect you from level 2 attackers, but they come fast in this game.

Soon you'll be rolling in cash. Your income per hour will exceed $13,000 after a little more than two hours invested. You'll get a significant amount of supplemental income by defending against attacks from players who forgot to vault their money. Next upgrades are the other Supply Depot to level 3, Armories to level 3, Storage Silos to level 3, Supply Depots to level 4. Keep packing on the Engineers. You'll want a minimum of 2x defense to your top rival's attack. Then up that to 3x to give the middle finger to the constant wave of attackers. Don't worry about the high casualty ranking. With so many Engineers you'll totally overrun the opposition and keep them all. 15 Engineers is a good starter amount for levels 2-4, but with the constant wave of attacks you may level up when not paying attention so it helps to be prepared. After 15 Engineers it is recommended to switch to Transports. Modern War allows five allies per level and four units per ally. Worked out, that means up to 20 units at level 1, 40 at level 2, 60 at level 3 and so on.

Once you've set up base camp, so to speak, it's up to you. You have a lot of breathing room as long as you avoid PvP, questing, and goal accomplishment. Fortunately the War Factory isn't awfully useful in the early going, as it is a goal. The rest is wide open, though. I suggest proceeding in this order: always be upgrading money buildings, expand territory to fit all the available money buildings then construct them, add to the vault max, add more land to fit unit buildings then construct them. Remember to build new money buildings as your level is forced higher due to defending attacks. Stockpile powerful units until satisfied then move on.

Note that game mechanics have changed significantly since this guide was created so some items may no longer apply.

The only sound economic advise would be to not start playing a GREE game.