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redlabel
09-15-2011, 01:56 AM
hi there,

first of all english is not my mother language, .but im doin my best in describing my problem. I am playing crime city since a month right now. For my level 51, im really weak (atk like 2150, def 2550), but have a good economy and an hourly income of 11000.

Untill now i was robbing enemys like they did to me and was succesful (90-95% robbery wins), cos im loosing in fights. Sometimes i won robberys against enemys with more than 4000 def. (we all know def is halved while robbing.)

Today i tried to rob enemys buildings and lost like 70-80%. I lost robberies against enemys with 2600-2700 def points.

Whats wrong now? Cant win the robberys anymore. Def is no more halved?

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:08 AM
CC game is heading to a dead end! It was all fun and addictive except for some glitches we complained about. Now with all the stupid in game changes, the rich gets richer, the poor becomes poorer and the weaker simply quits! Because only the higher lvls can play n the weaker simply camps. No attack or robs for weaks. This game is screwed and theres no more urge for me to keep playing anymore. Im losing interest cos i feel i cant play like before after the robbery changes.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:12 AM
The weaker ones or the ones who have invested their skills points in stamina hoping to get a good robbery can simply forget about it. They must be cursing and swearing as they cant rob (stronger players )or fight anymore (due screwed up rival list always showing higher lvl with higher att def).

redlabel
09-15-2011, 02:12 AM
cc means? (agree?)

as u say im getting robbed and cant balance it with own robberys anymore. Means no more respect coins, lesser income and getting weaker and weaker now... :(

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:18 AM
CC is Crime City.

Yes! Thats why i said the rich becomes richer by robbing just anyone. They earn respect coins and buy the weapons they desire and become stronger.

The poor gets poorer becos we are robbed, our collection drops. We have no respect coins or enuff money to buy upgrades or good weapons.

And the weak? Forget playing this game totally now and dont even consider spending any real money buying anything. Eventually it will be a bottleneck all stuck at a level.

redlabel
09-15-2011, 02:21 AM
maybe Crime City Mark can explain it for us...

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:28 AM
I have posted earlier than you in the techical page but he hasnt reply yet.

redlabel
09-15-2011, 02:50 AM
Sorry didnt see you posted it already, else i would lead on your thread. But i can see u are as pissed as i am :D

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:53 AM
Extremely pissed!! Cos i dont do fights. I only rob for fun. Now i cant rob so whats the point now?! I have posted in technical and suggestions. Feel free to go add more comments there

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 03:48 AM
Yes. It's the same for me. Too difficult to rob anyone now. It seems that people are able to rob me with ease and have a defence so high that I can't even begin to compete with them. Is this a bug or will this be how things are from now on with the half defence scrapped for robberies

Can you comment Mark??

Attacking people for me in the past was a lot of effort searching for people with a lower defence.
If robberies is going the same way I think I will be packing this game in.

I suggest people start altering their review scores on iTunes if you are not happy with the changes. I certainly will be doing because I no longer think it is the 5 star game it used to be

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 03:56 AM
Thats why i say this game is getting more n more screwed as each tweak is done! With this change in robbery, the dynamics have all changed. Only to favour the stronger and willing to pay real cash players. The weakers one will be calling this game quits soon.

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 04:35 AM
Completely agree with you.

I'm level 55

Att 3400
Def 3350

All the players around me have dfense of 4000+

So I can't fight them and win. And now I can't rob them either. I used to spend ages trying to find someone who I could fight and win. But that was so time consuming that I changed tactic to just robbing people. I'm not going to spend ages visiting hoods to try and find people I can rob!!

Are my stats really bad for my level? Can anyone comment?

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 05:58 AM
I have just been robbed by a guy who had an attack of 3100. And earlier today was robbed by a guy who's attack was 2770.

My defence is 3350

So how come they were able to rob me!! This is looking like it's an annoying bug. Please fix it! Or explain to us what is going on!

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 05:59 AM
joeycool, your att def stats are a bit low for your lvl at 55. but that isnt really important previously cos you can still rob and once a blue moon find someone your size to fight with (provided he/she isnt too beat up). but now, dynamics have shifted so much with this new n stupidest update for robberies. you can no longer rob higher levels and that put you in a bottleneck where u cant do anything except to camp.

thats why i previously mentioned it cuts off many players totally and only favours the higher levels players which is nonsense.

Nobby65
09-15-2011, 06:10 AM
well now my game is over, i cant rob i cant fight and my list has had the same people on it for 4 days all stronger than me. I GIVE UP UNTILL ITS SORTED OR I DELETE IT

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 06:14 AM
well now my game is over, i cant rob i cant fight and my list has had the same people on it for 4 days all stronger than me. I GIVE UP UNTILL ITS SORTED OR I DELETE IT
dont worry Nobby65, you are not alone on this. i guess there will be a good 30-40% of players quitting if this stupid system continues. cant fight cant rob then whats the point playing on right?

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 06:18 AM
@nvbealone

Thanks for the reply. Yeah I'm pretty new to this type of game but was just getting into it and figuring out how everything works. Now with robberies being how they are it is basically impossible for me to beat any one. Interestingly I looked at the people who had robbed me in my news feed.

One guy was at about 3100 att, and the other 2770. So how were they able to rob me!!?? My defence is 3500 now. Looks like it may be a bug rather than an update. But who knows. Would be nice if the devs responded hey?!!

I've never spent any money on the game so I guess I can't complain too much. But I'd be very unhappy right now if I had done! I think I'll be deleting the game. What's the point I'd you can't even rob anyone but people can Ron you at ease! :(

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 06:20 AM
i cant rob i cant fight and my list has had the same people on it for 4 days all stronger than me. IT

Me too mate! All way stronger than me.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 06:31 AM
@nvbealone

Thanks for the reply. Yeah I'm pretty new to this type of game but was just getting into it and figuring out how everything works. Now with robberies being how they are it is basically impossible for me to beat any one. Interestingly I looked at the people who had robbed me in my news feed.

One guy was at about 3100 att, and the other 2770. So how were they able to rob me!!?? My defence is 3500 now. Looks like it may be a bug rather than an update. But who knows. Would be nice if the devs responded hey?!!

I've never spent any money on the game so I guess I can't complain too much. But I'd be very unhappy right now if I had done! I think I'll be deleting the game. What's the point I'd you can't even rob anyone but people can Ron you at ease! :(
lets wait for the devs to reply and see how if it is a glitch or permanent. if it is permanant, i think i am outta here too!

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 06:55 AM
you can no longer rob higher levels and that put you in a bottleneck where u cant do anything except to camp

@nvbealone

What do you mean by camping? Like I say I'm new to the game type so don't know what that means?

Cheers.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 07:19 AM
joeycool, it means you remain where you are and not level up. just collecting income from your buildings and buying weapons to build yourself up stronger. it also means not doing any quests, robbing and fighting. just collecting money that's it.

phantom123
09-15-2011, 07:52 AM
Its funny... I always thought I would post here with some insight such as how long it takes to build certain buildings and their upgrade costs. Not whine or complain. But this is ridiculous. Not everyone who plays this game has the same strategy. I focused on expanding my Lot and creating/upgrading buildings to have a constant flow of money and establish a running economy. Though I do have 43 stamina at lvl 63 for "Robberies". This new update changes everything. Cant Rob anyone at all. Now I will have to use my hard earned cash and my bank balance (950,000) to purchase weapons and armors.

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 07:57 AM
Ah okay. Well thanks for the advice. Looks like I'm going to have to do that for a while. Just level up my buildings etc to the max and then use the money to buy good weapons to bring my level up to scratch.

I have only recently discovered the importance of levelling up buildings for cash income. But getting good weapons is sooo expensive if you don't buy gold. I used to just fight and rob for respect to buy better weapons. Now that option is gone.

The devs should tell us what exactly each update does. The way robberies work now is going to stitch up a lot of people.

Junglistical
09-15-2011, 07:59 AM
They needed to do something it was unbalanced before. However, this is the other extreme.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 08:06 AM
this is too much the extreme! if halving the def is too much, probably the range of 20-40% higher than own attack will work.. not like this when it is like 1-1? it will kill too many people at once. unless the devs are planning to let this wonderful game fail once and for all?!

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 08:08 AM
They needed to do something it was unbalanced before. However, this is the other extreme.

Previously if I robbed a player who was stronger than me they could get their own back by attacking me. This is an advantage to players as there are achievements for winning a certain number of attacks. Likewise if someone robbed me I could be pretty sure they robbed me because they didn't have enough strength to attack me so I would attack them. Recently I see the same players in my rivals list and All the players who's hood I visit have way better attack and way better defence. I simply can't do anything to them now. This way is much worse as far as I'm concerned.

wupuck
09-15-2011, 08:12 AM
If anything maybe a small tweak that rewards those who build properly. Say 2-3 times to rob a midlevel warehouse if a robbers attack is within 25% of a defenders defense but 0% if its a level 8+ building.

If someone w no weapons and poor attack could easily rob a level 7 warehouse from a well defended hood that would be just stupid

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 08:17 AM
It would just be nice if they actually told us exactly what was going on instead of completely moving the goal posts with out saying anything! Very frustrating!

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 08:20 AM
the previous version when def wasnt halved works. if we are weak, we can still rob and the one being robbed can attack back and get the exp points and respects points. both parties gains and everyone has a fair chance to play.. not all hoods are avail for robbing anyways. so is more of luck that he/she chances upon and hit on it.

now, dynamics changed totally, no robbing or fighting for weaker players. so what the devs want them to do? just camp and rot ?!

phantom123
09-15-2011, 08:32 AM
I need to hear from a developer if this is a temporary situation or not. Because if it isn't then I'm going to have to delete a LOT of defense buildings so I can have room for Money buildings. Also I will not expand anymore since that'd be pointless. I agree, robbing was a nice good way to get back for being attacked but now thats out the window.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 08:35 AM
we are all waiting for devs to revert but as of now there's no news from them at all. darnz!

core
09-15-2011, 08:35 AM
Indeed the robbery part is getting more difficult as of today!

But...-for my part-, its stil very good hunting. Can still rob and attack with ease in my level (lvl 31 A:1362 D:1529).
The only difference is I cant rob blind anymore, I have to look at their stats to be sure after some misfortunes.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 08:38 AM
Indeed the robbery part is getting more difficult as of today!

But...-for my part-, its stil very good hunting. Can still rob and attack with ease in my level (lvl 31 A:1362 D:1529).
The only difference is I cant rob blind anymore, I have to look at their stats to be sure after some misfortunes.
very soon u will swallow back on this statement you made here. nothing offensive dont get me wrong but i can almost guarantee you if you want to stay in this game. you have to buy all the weapons which you make you bankrupt faster than you can win any robberies later as you level up.

core
09-15-2011, 08:40 AM
hehe, will keep you posted on next levels ;-)

phantom123
09-15-2011, 08:41 AM
True. Cash will only get you so far in this game. The way I see it, after spending all the cash you will ever earn all you will be able to do is win "robberies" not attacks. This update does wonders for GOLD players.

ogel45
09-15-2011, 08:49 AM
I too leveled up too quickly (where the heck is a user manual?) and am now at level 52 with only around 3000 for attack and defense. I have noticed that I can still rob laundromats - but just once. If I try it a second time I fail. So I guess I'm stuck doing that in order to earn respect points.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 08:49 AM
simply put it, every update is making the game more screwed. Period.

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 09:04 AM
True. Cash will only get you so far in this game. The way I see it, after spending all the cash you will ever earn all you will be able to do is win "robberies" not attacks. This update does wonders for GOLD players.

I think you have hit the nail on the head there mate. It just looks like they are forcing you to buy gold or you won't be able to do much in the game. If the gold wasn't so ridiculously over priced that would be fair enough.

Interestingly even though this is a hot thread no devs are answering us.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 09:06 AM
i seriously hope they aren't sitting on it because this is a pretty major change to the dynamics of the game! unless like i say, they are heading for the end of this game.

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 09:08 AM
simply put it, every update is making the game more screwed. Period.

Agreed. Its looking a bit poor for us people who don't want to spend on gold.

phantom123
09-15-2011, 09:10 AM
End of the game? not really. Keep in mind that they have to make money. Doing this type of stuff will force most of us to resort to spending real money and thats how the developers get paid. Meanwhile I need to figure out what I should do with my Stamina lol.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 09:18 AM
yeah most players wont want to spend real money as it makes no sense doing so for a mobile game. if i need to spend, i would rather do it for my PC game or PS3 at least the gaming experience is so much better isnt it? so if they wana make such drastic and extreme change to the game just to make people spend, then i would say this game is no longer worth any consideration playing. most, if not all games on the app store gives an even platform for paying and non paying gamers to be involved in the game.. not like this in CC.

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 09:25 AM
I agree with you nvbealone... I think we have to wait to see if Mark responds to the thread. I doubt he will though to be honest. They probably only care about selling gold.

I suggest if we don't hear back then we use the only power we have and review the game on the app store as we see it. Or delete the game. Or just camp like you suggested to get better weapons etc. But that's pretty boring!

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 09:28 AM
Plus realistically there isn't many people complaining about it. Only 5 or 6 of us on this thread. Perhaps everyone else is happy with it!!

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 09:50 AM
i reckon there are many players viewing the thread but not posting and just keeping mum on it and hoping something good would change. i call all players who arent happy with this change to post here. at least it lets the devs see this change really is killing most of the players.

phantom123
09-15-2011, 10:55 AM
I guess if this doesnt change my best bet is to restart. Since the game has been completely Overhauled. Will have to spend my money and respect tOwards gear. There is just tOo much downtime now. Waiting to get money from buildings and energy to refill. Or quit.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 10:59 AM
1st it is building times extended to make income lesser.. bad move. 2nd, robberies are tweaked and player no longer have income from robberies and respect points to buy equipments... worse move. i dun reckon all these are bugs/glitches, it is here to stay and i think i will be outta here very soon.

phantom123
09-15-2011, 11:13 AM
Building times extended? I thought they fixed that. Can you give an example

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 11:19 AM
i think is slightly reverted. im doing upgrading for my house from level 8 to 9 and is taking 77hrs. i duno if this is normal cos my laudromat didnt take so long back then

Dfeziggy
09-15-2011, 11:46 AM
If this is an attempt to sell gold then I am really disappointed. The logical way to sell more gold is to increase the value of gold. While the changes do make gold a major advantage it is also making the game less appealing. Wouldn't it be more prudent to make gold go further thus making it more appealing without effecting the non-gold players? If you run off those not buying gold then those that do will not have any reason to buy... Furthermore slowing down the game also leaves greater opportunity to loose interest in the game. So far all the changes in my opinion are counterproductive and I can speak from both perspectives. I have bought gold only to find out that it is very little advantages unless you are willing to spend a god awful amount.

Can anyone at funzio do math? At 10gold per hour to speed building that is 24 dollars to instant upgrade a level 7 luandromat... Do you really expect people to spend hundreds of dollars on this game? Wouldn't it be more beneficial to incourage the masses to spend a few bucks then to try and get a few to spend a bunch?

I have enjoyed playing this game and I hope funzio takes into consideration that happy gamers play more and therefore spend more.. If not there are always other games to play..

Squishh
09-15-2011, 11:49 AM
If you guys are level 50 to 60 something, with only 3-4k att/def, then simply put, you leveled way to fast. The norm for your level is 6-7k for att/def. So you guys are WAY behind the curve for your level. It is not the dev's fault at all.

Also, they way robberies were before was unbalanced. If I have 7k defense, and a person with 3.2k attack is helping themselves to my 3 hour buildings, only losing 1 of 10 attempts, to me that is broken.

I was staring to wonder what good defensive buildings even had in this game. Now they serve their purpose.

QQ'ing about the robbey adjustments is the wrong way to look at this. The issue is your stuck rival list. You like everyone else has had the 20 people stuck on thier rival lists for close to a week now. A week ago everyone on the list was around the same level. Now the range is 10-15 levels, and growing everyday. This prevents you from finding others that are near your current att/def rating. If this gets fixed you will find people to rob and attack, and have success.

This next comment is my point of view. If a person is close to my level, but 3-4k below my defensive stat, then they should not be able to have free reign on my buildings. Period! Thats how it was before, and I found that very annoying. I felt like I was wasting my money on defensive builldings, defensive upgrades, and defensive equipment. Now I feel like those purchase choices are worth while.

An FYI, your most important stat is not attack or defense. It is your income per hour. If your income is at a good rate, your att/def will fall into place as well.

A pro tip for anyone getting started. Get 2 Laundromats up to level 10 ASAP. $750.00 every 5 min opens a lot of options early on. Nothing else compares early on.

phantom123
09-15-2011, 12:04 PM
Don't tell me you are on this game every 5 min to get $750. Buildings such as Italian restaurant are more realistic for me but everyone has their own style to play and there is no need to criticize that. All I am saying is that this is a big change and such a change should not have been implemented without notice. If I wouldve known this 2 days ago I wouldve not spent 760000 on a loft and 750000 on expansion. Instead I would had bougt gear so my stamina doesn't go to waste.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 12:05 PM
i earlier mentioned somethings has to give. if the rival list is screwed and this change takes place. then almost everyone is screwed big time. if this change is here to stay, at least the rival list shows a lower level and not 95% higher players. is like WTF?! forcing us to be campers? or best, to be out of this game?!

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 12:55 PM
If you guys are level 50 to 60 something, with only 3-4k att/def, then simply put, you leveled way to fast. The norm for your level is 6-7k for att/def. So you guys are WAY behind the curve for your level. It is not the devs fault at all

Well i didn't choose to level up to fast. I simply followed the challenges that were laud out in the goals list and then went back and mastered every level as I went along. Also why should you have to slow down your development. People have different strategies. That's what was good about the game. Your strategy was obviously building up lots of money by building your hood. They have now essentially took away the stategy of having no buildings but just robbing people. Instead of getting energy they go for lots of stamina which is now useless.

TheGasman
09-15-2011, 12:59 PM
I get my kicks from robbing folk & having stand offs that way it is a great game & would think about spending money. Unfortunately you won't get Mark to reply to this, they don't know what they're doing. My son is on lvl 30 & he can't rob anymore either. All the nerds & paranoid freaks have built up their defences because they are on the game 24/7. They are fat, ugly & have no friends. This game is their life & spend all their time here. Really sad! ****e game folks, it ends by the time you get to level 40, if you don't spend your cash. I am deleting.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 01:17 PM
by following the quests, we are moving with the game and we are not leveling too fast at all. if we are then whats the damn quests for anyways? no one plays 24/7 and collects every 5 min and so the stupid laudromat doesnt work at all! we all have diff strategies to play by. some prefer to rob, some just wana fight. but with this change, robbing is no longer at option and fighting is outta question for weaker players. they are simply sitting duck for pple to att and rob. what can they do? NOTHING!

while some just wana save up lotsa money and spend it later on equipments for revenge later part. they rob for fun, for respect points and save them up later in the game. whats wrong with it? the only thing i see with this tweak is to favour the higher levels and those willing to spend real money. those who just wana play, are not considered in this tweak and simply put it, we can go screw ourselves!

Joeycool
09-15-2011, 01:32 PM
It may not be as bad as we all thought anyway. I have had a few successful robberies tonight.

Fir example against a guy who's def was 4400 to my attack of 3500. I robbed his 9 ranked pizza palour. 1st time failed. Second 2 times succeeded. It looks like you just may not win every single time with out failure. maybe you just have to try a couple if times. Give it a try and see what you think guys.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 01:43 PM
anything within 1k higher i think is fine with a couple of attempts but seriously how many players in your rivals list fits the bill? and not to forget, his/her hood isnt always avail to be robbed. so if you only have 2-3 players u can hit on and they are keeping vigil on it and collecting it, there's nothing u can robbed after all. so it still dont work ya?

phantom123
09-15-2011, 01:48 PM
Over 600 views. Where is Mark at? Let us know already if his is permanent or not.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 01:55 PM
he is normally quite fast to reply. seems like he dont wana answer to this?

wupuck
09-15-2011, 02:14 PM
he is normally quite fast to reply. seems like he dont wana answer to this?

I would be interested to hear what the stats of folks complaining about the robbing.

Both attack and defense
as well as the attack/defense of the opponent your robbing
AND the level of the building.

If a low level is complaining they can't rob from a better defended level 4 warehouse, they need to stop whining.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:24 PM
I would be interested to hear what the stats of folks complaining about the robbing.

Both attack and defense
as well as the attack/defense of the opponent your robbing
AND the level of the building.

If a low level is complaining they can't rob from a better defended level 4 warehouse, they need to stop whining.
i choose to not disclose my stats but 1 thing for sure im not at a low level with lousy att/def stats and if u wana know, my hourly income is higher than most players in the range of 15k-20k.

and this is this a public forum, i guess all have the right to comment and give their input no matter how high or low his/her level is just to be fair?

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:27 PM
also i normally rob players of higher levels with higher def so the lower levels dont feel exploited. 90% of my time im robbing than fighting as i find robbing more fun and catches players off guard.

wupuck
09-15-2011, 02:28 PM
i choose to not disclose my stats but 1 thing for sure im not at a low level with lousy att/def stats and if u wana know, my hourly income is higher than most players in the range of 15k-20k.

and this is this a public forum, i guess all have the right to comment and give their input no matter how high or low his/her level is just to be fair?

Of course, but i'm sure u can agree, someone who's built their mob correctly would have much better say then someone who's main source of income in the game is just from robbing.

I'm sure u read my earlier post.

I'm fair w/ a certain amount of robbing, but if a lower level attacks a well defended hood, they should be rebuffed most of the time.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 02:41 PM
yes that i agree but i think this change is too drastic. it will be good if it was not like a 1-1 tweak. maybe a 20-30% +/- might be easier to be accepted. this change is really killing too many players.

phantom123
09-15-2011, 04:09 PM
Okay... So seems like this change is here to stay since Mark is ignorIng us. I know where I messed up. Used my respect points to buy bikes and more expensive ****. What dO oh guys tnk will haPPen if I reduce y mafia numbers? Weaker rivals?

wupuck
09-15-2011, 04:34 PM
Possible. Storm8 games had a "bucket system " that put players in a grouping. If u significantly reduced ur Mafia, u would go back to the smaller grouping, but occasionally folks in the higher grouping could see u and beat up on u

phantom123
09-15-2011, 05:33 PM
Down to 250 mafia at lvl 63 yet the list shows the same people. Also noticed that I lose 1 attack and defense per Mafia member. Spend 25000 on weapons which didn't help much at all...

rustbinlid
09-15-2011, 05:40 PM
i reckon there are many players viewing the thread but not posting and just keeping mum on it and hoping something good would change. i call all players who arent happy with this change to post here. at least it lets the devs see this change really is killing most of the players.

Not lurking just wanted to read the whole thing. Are most of you higher than level 50? I am level 39 and so far not having any trouble robbing or fighting. I appear to have higher attack defence than most on my level but that is because I upgraded defence buildings and I am careful about the stats of the weapons purchased. You talk about gold players in the negative, but without them there would be no game development at all.
The devs should be fair obviously, but are you really implying that you as a player are being hard done by because others have better defence. Everyone else on your level cannot possibly be gold players. One of you quoted defence stats that are worse than mine and I am several levels below you. Come on guys.

rustbinlid
09-15-2011, 05:46 PM
Indeed the robbery part is getting more difficult as of today!

But...-for my part-, its stil very good hunting. Can still rob and attack with ease in my level (lvl 31 A:1362 D:1529).
The only difference is I cant rob blind anymore, I have to look at their stats to be sure after some misfortunes.

Who robs blind anyway? This is exactly what I mean in the prevs post, are some of you really helping yourselves? I do come on this forum to ask some stupid question everyday but even I realised when still in single figures that I should check player stats before robbing or attacking them. You cannot blame everything on gold.

Crime City Mark
09-15-2011, 06:29 PM
Wow, I don't respond to a thread right away and suddenly I'm ignoring you? Calm down a bit. We released a change late last night that increased the stats of defense buildings slightly. Your item defense is still halved when you're being robbed.

We're looking over the fight/robbery results after this tweak and we may make further adjustments.

cookies
09-15-2011, 07:29 PM
Personally i dont have any problems robbing anyone, my stats are quite decent however. It was a bit silly to get robbed by people that barely have over 1/4 attack of what my defense is.

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 08:10 PM
Wow, I don't respond to a thread right away and suddenly I'm ignoring you? Calm down a bit. We released a change late last night that increased the stats of defense buildings slightly. Your item defense is still halved when you're being robbed.

We're looking over the fight/robbery results after this tweak and we may make further adjustments.

Mark, you mentioned still halved? I did try robbing slightly less than 2x my attack just to try out but lost all 10 fights in 1 go. So what tweaks were really done? We need you to shed some light on this. Tks

nvbealone
09-15-2011, 08:34 PM
Wow, I don't respond to a thread right away and suddenly I'm ignoring you? Calm down a bit. We released a change late last night that increased the stats of defense buildings slightly. Your item defense is still halved when you're being robbed.

We're looking over the fight/robbery results after this tweak and we may make further adjustments.
Mark, u mentioned i have been warned before? Since when was that? Seriously i have no idea about it. Until the msg u sent telling me is the final warning? WTH is going on?

Squishh
09-15-2011, 08:50 PM
A pro tip for anyone getting started. Get 2 Laundromats up to level 10 ASAP. $750.00 every 5 min opens a lot of options early on. Nothing else compares early on.

@ nvbealone & phantom123

Here is one comment from my previous post on this subject.

Notice.....its sais things like "getting started", and "early on". This is a strat that worked for ME at the beginning levels.

NO other building produces more income early on. I spent the first 2 weeks upgrading my laundromats. I was not on 24/7 to collect cash from my laundromats every 5 min. However, when I was on to collect, it provided a quick easy cash flow to build up attack.

I bought a lot of brass knuckles (3A, 2D), and machine pistols (2A, 2D). This allowed me to become one of the harder hitters on the the rival list due to quantity of weapons for my mafia to use. Being on top of the food chain early on allowed me to rack up winning steak quests with ease, which in turn provided a steady flow of respect tokens for combat boots, and tommy guns.

This strat would not work at higher levels. $750.00 at higher levels does not get a person much, but at level 25 or lower its was a great flow of income to buy cheap weapons to stack attack rating.

At level 62 the majority of my weapons, and armor come from respect tokens. Upgrading my laundromats very early on made this possible. I now only log in every 3 hours to collect, burn through my energy and stam pools quick, and allow my buildings to be robbed at night.

I am not saying this is the only be all, end all strat. But it worked very well for me. If I was forced to start over, I would use the exact approach early on.

phantom123
09-15-2011, 09:45 PM
Thanks for the tip. I know how to play his game and I know how to do it really well. I wouldnt earn 200000 a day if I didn't at lvl 64 :). What's important for me is to have no downtime. Always have an expansion Loading, building something and upgrading something. My only complaint is that I wasn't warned before this huge change. But that's okay. I'll catch up.... It'll take sometime and resources which I planned to spent elsewhere but I have no choice.

Tuck
09-16-2011, 04:36 AM
Aside from the attack/defense I've noticed when I lose a robbery now they have either a Police armoured truck or a Chain Whip. I clicked on them & the chain whip isn't availible till lv55 (not a loot item). I started seeing that acouple days ago wen I was lv 50. Now 52. The truck is a loot item & I'd like to know which goal I need to get it.

redinator
09-16-2011, 08:04 AM
I agree you.






If this is an attempt to sell gold then I am really disappointed. The logical way to sell more gold is to increase the value of gold. While the changes do make gold a major advantage it is also making the game less appealing. Wouldn't it be more prudent to make gold go further thus making it more appealing without effecting the non-gold players? If you run off those not buying gold then those that do will not have any reason to buy... Furthermore slowing down the game also leaves greater opportunity to loose interest in the game. So far all the changes in my opinion are counterproductive and I can speak from both perspectives. I have bought gold only to find out that it is very little advantages unless you are willing to spend a god awful amount.

Can anyone at funzio do math? At 10gold per hour to speed building that is 24 dollars to instant upgrade a level 7 luandromat... Do you really expect people to spend hundreds of dollars on this game? Wouldn't it be more beneficial to incourage the masses to spend a few bucks then to try and get a few to spend a bunch?

I have enjoyed playing this game and I hope funzio takes into consideration that happy gamers play more and therefore spend more.. If not there are always other games to play..

kimberleyj
09-16-2011, 09:48 AM
Mark, you mentioned still halved? I did try robbing slightly less than 2x my attack just to try out but lost all 10 fights in 1 go. So what tweaks were really done? We need you to shed some light on this. Tks

Same here. It bugs me because it means I don't know if I will be able to finsh missions even though I have a mix of money and def buildings and a lot of my weapons are ones I got with respect.

Also when I got to level 44 I started seeing a lot of people with the chain weapon that is 750 respect (some of them had a few of them) and yet when I try to buy it , it says you can't because your not level 55.

rustbinlid
09-16-2011, 10:34 AM
Aside from the attack/defense I've noticed when I lose a robbery now they have either a Police armoured truck or a Chain Whip. I clicked on them & the chain whip isn't availible till lv55 (not a loot item). I started seeing that acouple days ago wen I was lv 50. Now 52. The truck is a loot item & I'd like to know which goal I need to get it.

I was given at chain whip back at level 36 for a fight streak. And an armoured truck for another fight streak. Obviously the fight streaks are not directly affected by your level, so you need to do more fight tournements til you get these.
Sorry I cannot remember the number of the streak.

For winning streak 21 was given a Yamaha Race Bike, which has 13 attack & 12 defence points.

wupuck
09-16-2011, 01:31 PM
Wow, I don't respond to a thread right away and suddenly I'm ignoring you? Calm down a bit. We released a change late last night that increased the stats of defense buildings slightly. Your item defense is still halved when you're being robbed.

We're looking over the fight/robbery results after this tweak and we may make further adjustments.

If you don't want folks to feel ignored Mark, can you please give some sort of feedback in this tread:
http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?9304-Will-the-real-Attack-value-please-stand-up

Thank you.

Synergy
09-16-2011, 02:03 PM
Im at level 74 with approx 9200 attack and 11800 defense. I have a lot to say about this. I don't have much time right this second, but I'm definitely coming back to post a lengthy response. I agree that before the change, it was way too easy to be robbed by players with attack stats that were nowhere near my defense. But now, I'm losing robberies to players with defense thousands under my attack, with hardly any defense buildings, and the ones they do have are at very low levels.

Now, it seems it's much more difficult to rob anyone successfully. Just looking at my stats and then looking at theirs and their defense buildings, anyone would think that I could easily successfully rob them, which is not the case. I'm not understanding how this is being calculated at all. Mark, can you explain specifically the changes with the defense buildings?

Crime City Mark
09-16-2011, 03:53 PM
Mark, u mentioned i have been warned before? Since when was that? Seriously i have no idea about it. Until the msg u sent telling me is the final warning? WTH is going on?

http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?8704-Devs-pls-assist-amp-advise&p=35337#post35337

Crime City Mark
09-16-2011, 03:54 PM
If you don't want folks to feel ignored Mark, can you please give some sort of feedback in this tread:
http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?9304-Will-the-real-Attack-value-please-stand-up

Thank you.

The forum is not the correct place to go if you need to contact a dev. Send an e-mail to mobile@funzio.com. The forum is a place for players to discuss things.

Crime City Mark
09-16-2011, 03:55 PM
Mark, can you explain specifically the changes with the defense buildings?

Unfortunately not.

kusio
09-16-2011, 05:32 PM
I'm guessing they just tried to 'rebalance' things. I just lost 5 straight fights to two people, one with Def below 5000, the other Def below 4000. My Att is 6651. Over the course of the afternoon I fought the same two at least 30 times and won every one. It just wiped out my Champ Round 39 wins. Balanced? Funzio Games - the Fox News of gaming.

nvbealone
09-16-2011, 05:56 PM
I rest my case now. This game is screwed and i will just camp. Once im sick of it i will just delete.

nvbealone
09-16-2011, 05:58 PM
http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?8704-Devs-pls-assist-amp-advise&p=35337#post35337
So this forum isnt a place to ask devs for help or answer? Now this is made known i wont be asking anymore.

nvbealone
09-16-2011, 06:00 PM
I rrally start to wonder what is this forum all about now? Only to discuss and we just have to guess and suck it up. Hmmm...

I always thought a forum is to get someone of authority to help in some ways as most, if not all forums work that way. At least the devs dont get bombarded by emails daily.

Well, enough said and if you are reading CC Mark, i really thank your assistance and effort replying to me and all others.

Cheerios!

bn3
09-16-2011, 07:00 PM
4x upgrade times was just plain retarded

Better defence against robberies was in my opinion a nice and welcom Change but in the last hour or so they seem to have tweaked it in the wrong direction Evan moor, along with attack as well I just lost 15 stam in a row on 2 opponents with a few hundred less def then my attack this change now fits into the retarded section also .

Changing game mechanics without warning or any kind of info into how thing now work = you guessed it ... Retarded.

Having a section for "news and updates" and not using it is....retarded

Forum admins/mods replying with only the answer Unfortunately not. Is quite inadequate which may be found within some online thesaurus along side the word .... Retarded

I contemplated spending a little cash on this game just because I love ice cream but I'm pretty glad I didn't as I would be feeling pretty retarded right now if I had .

I would very much like to see some thoughts from people who have traded cash for gold though

cookies
09-16-2011, 07:02 PM
I'm guessing they just tried to 'rebalance' things. I just lost 5 straight fights to two people, one with Def below 5000, the other Def below 4000. My Att is 6651. Over the course of the afternoon I fought the same two at least 30 times and won every one. It just wiped out my Champ Round 39 wins. Balanced? Funzio Games - the Fox News of gaming.

I am curious as to where you have spent your skillpoints. If it is mostly defense or energy/stam while the other player put alot into defense i guess you are much more likely to fail attacks since skillpoints in attack/defense would work as a multiplier of sorts.

Gunn
09-16-2011, 07:15 PM
cc please get it together. The only reason we are all so upset is because we all really like this game and are watching it be ruined. You had a good thing going before, get back to what got you so popular.

As for everyone going on about how the new changes are made to benefit people who spend money on gold, I think you are overestimating the impact gold has on your game. Lets say you spend $50 to buy 650 gold. If you spend this all on weapons it can increase your attack and defense 300-350. It's a nice perk, but when you get to a point where your overall scores are a couple thosand and above, what you gain from the gold is small potatoes. Yes buying gold can give you a little edge, but it's not that big of a game changer. The issue that most of you probably actually have is that you progress to quickly. Take your time, develope your hood. Don't try to level up too fast, or you'll find yourself a level 30 something in a couple days and you'll be the weakest one around. I've been playing for about a month and I'm only level 18, but my attack is 765 defense is 1242 and my hourly income is 9748.

phantom123
09-16-2011, 07:31 PM
Lol... I don't know what they did but I am winning fights like crazy if I am attacked. But when I attack back I lose. That shows they are buffing defense. Funny thing is I delete almost all my defense buildings so I could have more money buildings to generate income that I could spend on weapons. And ive nvr gven any skill points to my defense stats. Anyway,That's going to help me win some challenges... I am still hoping everything changes back to normal

phantom123
09-16-2011, 07:40 PM
So what am I suppose to do??? Let my energy and stamina go to waste as the are sitting full? That's just stupid. Don't knOw what the rant is about lvlin up too fast. The mistake I made was buying 59 freaking yamahas where I should've stuck to combat boots and Tommy gun. And my income is 15000 per hour at lvl 64. And NO I did not update my landromats past lvl 7 because I am not on every 5 Mins. I've got 2 of every building except loft (only 1). Internet building and so forth

nvbealone
09-16-2011, 07:50 PM
So what am I suppose to do??? Let my energy and stamina go to waste as the are sitting full? That's just stupid. Don't knOw what the rant is about lvlin up too fast. The mistake I made was buying 59 freaking yamahas where I should've stuck to combat boots and Tommy gun. And my income is 15000 per hour at lvl 64. And NO I did not update my landromats past lvl 7 because I am not on every 5 Mins. I've got 2 of every building except loft (only 1). Internet building and so forth
Continue fighting and robbing if u dont wana waste? But i think a wiser choice is to wait out? Rather than finish it up and the bug gets fixed and your down to 0 then.

Synergy
09-16-2011, 07:55 PM
Ok. The robberies are ridiculos now. Mark, the reason I was asking specifics about the change was just so I could know what to do in order to improve my robbery chances against players who I'm losing all attempted robberies against who only have a few defense buildings at low levels and thousands less defense than my attack. Can you give any advice to the players who are really into the game and might have dropped decent amounts of cash on the game as far as how to better improve our chances with the new robbery setup?

I've finishes the thug life goals and championship rounds where you earn a lot of respect points so the only respect points I'm getting are from robberies and attacks so basically the only way to increase my attack quicker is to buy gold items I'm guessing?

Also I had one more question. I know the robbery setup is different but has the attack setup changed at all? Because the last couple days I've been losing to players I was easily beating before.

It's just frustrating knowing I've spent a decent amour of cash on the game and am losing to people with much less attack and defense and hardly any defense buildings man. That's all. I'm still totally addicted though so I'll be looking forward to see how this plays out.

phantom123
09-16-2011, 07:59 PM
Continue fighting and robbing if u dont wana waste? But i think a wiser choice is to wait out? Rather than finish it up and the bug gets fixed and your down to 0 then.

Whatever man... I am going to the gym to blow some steam. Hopefully they figure this out by morning. I don't even care. Pvp isn't fun no more. Obviously the stronger will get stronger because every time he wins he gets those boxers or sg rifle and that police truck not to mention the respect coins on the other hand we are ducks. Equipment you buy from money sucks. Steel boot, shot gun and freaking knuckles lol

nvbealone
09-16-2011, 08:03 PM
Did u see my earlier posts abt the strong getting stronger, rich getting richer, poor can simply lick themselves? Lol enjoy your gym and try not to pvp at the gym taking out all of them to get respect points! LMAO

kusio
09-16-2011, 09:44 PM
I am curious as to where you have spent your skillpoints. If it is mostly defense or energy/stam while the other player put alot into defense i guess you are much more likely to fail attacks since skillpoints in attack/defense would work as a multiplier of sorts.

Att 23
Def 60
E 1020
Stam 12

If you're trying to tell me that skill point distribution is the reason I should be losing fights to rivals with a Def 2000 to 3000 less than my Att, I'd say that's crazy. Before today, I don't recall ever losing a fight to a rival with a 1000 point differential between my Att and his Def, let alone 2000 - 3000, until today.

Again, the two rivals I lost to I fight regularly and I've never lost a fight with either of them. So, humoring you... if it is a skills thing, at one time my points were distributed just fine with regards to these two rivals. Then, over the span of a few hours, the balance gets turned on its head? If Funzio creates such large swings in the game play as a result of their efforts to continuously improve the game, how can any player distribute points to suit their strategy not knowing how that point distribution will work in the next hour, next day, or next week.

By the way, dumping so many points into my Def hasn't really helped me thwart attacks all that much. I get beat up regularly by others where the att/def differential isn't all that much. And I don't seem to have any advantage in attacking them, which is what you would expect if they had dumped a bunch of skill points into Att rather than Def. If the skills multiplier were as significant as you suggest, I would expect a different result.

Maybe we should all pitch in and buy Funzio a test platform. Tweaking a live game is insanity, especially if they don't know what they are doing.

phantom123
09-16-2011, 10:12 PM
That's a pretty good idea. Not sure if it's possible but high end game does that like world of Warcraft. I think what thy should do is make the change at night time and observe it before morning so it doesn't impact the majority of the players

cookies
09-16-2011, 11:58 PM
Att 23
Def 60
E 1020
Stam 12

If you're trying to tell me that skill point distribution is the reason I should be losing fights to rivals with a Def 2000 to 3000 less than my Att, I'd say that's crazy. Before today, I don't recall ever losing a fight to a rival with a 1000 point differential between my Att and his Def, let alone 2000 - 3000, until today.

Again, the two rivals I lost to I fight regularly and I've never lost a fight with either of them. So, humoring you... if it is a skills thing, at one time my points were distributed just fine with regards to these two rivals. Then, over the span of a few hours, the balance gets turned on its head? If Funzio creates such large swings in the game play as a result of their efforts to continuously improve the game, how can any player distribute points to suit their strategy not knowing how that point distribution will work in the next hour, next day, or next week.

By the way, dumping so many points into my Def hasn't really helped me thwart attacks all that much. I get beat up regularly by others where the att/def differential isn't all that much. And I don't seem to have any advantage in attacking them, which is what you would expect if they had dumped a bunch of skill points into Att rather than Def. If the skills multiplier were as significant as you suggest, I would expect a different result.

Maybe we should all pitch in and buy Funzio a test platform. Tweaking a live game is insanity, especially if they don't know what they are doing.

It would make sense to me at least. You seem to have about 30% higher attack than their defense, yet very low attack skill. Your energy is high which lets you do more jobs, yet 60 defense may not be enough to help you alot. I seem to be much lower level than you but have have a good amount more in attack than your defense is. I dont put much into energy at all, and have yet to loose a fight since the patch (even tried some rivals with stats higher than i would usually attempt and didnt loose).

Out of 195 points total spent only 22 went into attack, which means only 10ish% of your points actually help you attack. I would expect you loose against anyone with similar stats as yours *if* they have spent any points in defense. On the other hand, since the patch you should probably be successfully defending against PvE point distributions like your own.

nvbealone
09-17-2011, 12:21 AM
still no updates on this issue?

phantom123
09-17-2011, 07:11 AM
It's not that bad now... Yu can rob peoPle with 1500 more defense with ease. Try it

nvbealone
09-17-2011, 08:33 AM
Building my tent to camp. Lol

Cooz
09-17-2011, 08:50 AM
I don't seem to be having the same problem as the other posters here, although I did notice a little less success in robbing, and more success in defending from being robbed.

I hadn't read this thread when all this was going down the other day, I just figured it was because I sunk a lot of time and effort into buying AKs, and the results were a better defense. I attributed the increase is losses when robbing to "ya can't win 'em all."

MaximusBC
09-17-2011, 01:07 PM
Robberies are too difficult. Way too difficult. If you don't collect it then it should be up for grabs.

phantom123
09-17-2011, 01:22 PM
Robberies are too difficult. Way too difficult. If you don't collect it then it should be up for grabs.

Thats how I roll. No defense buildings excePt a few gattling guns lvl 3. Every morning I wake up I lose about 12000. Don't give a ****. Just spreading the wealth lol. I think funzio will get it. Lot better than what it was 2 days ago.

What bothers me is that we have had about 2500 views but the same 3 peoPle giving feedback.

rustbinlid
09-17-2011, 02:09 PM
Thats how I roll. No defense buildings excePt a few gattling guns lvl 3. Every morning I wake up I lose about 12000. Don't give a ****. Just spreading the wealth lol. I think funzio will get it. Lot better than what it was 2 days ago.

What bothers me is that we have had about 2500 views but the same 3 peoPle giving feedback.

That is just crazy talk.

Cookie
09-17-2011, 03:18 PM
I agree that robberies are now near impossible. Probably lvl'd too fast my own fault as I was tryin to work out what stratedgy to use. What I would like to know is some basic game rules so you can choose which direction in the game you would like to go. Now that my stats are so low for my lvl, my only options are to camp and collect money to by weapons or purchase gold (not at all likely as it will only make a short term difference unless I continue to buy more gold). I can do the goals and lvl up even quicker and just get continually robbed by stronger players who have previously benefited before the changes and who can continue to reap the respect points.

So I think camping may be my only option. Wait for my current rivals to leave my level and hit some new up and comers who may not have lvl up appropriately and reap the rewards.

rustbinlid
09-17-2011, 03:42 PM
I have just taken over 11000 from someone whose buildings are mainly 5's and 7's. My stamina has run out but I am still in that hood. This person would be crazy not to at least try revenge on me when they wake up. In 2 days I have managed almost 100k from robberies, attacks. Including attacks on me. So far only 2 people have successfully managed to rob my hood, once each in the last 2 days.

Cooz
09-17-2011, 04:08 PM
I have just taken over 11000 from someone whose buildings are mainly 5's and 7's. My stamina has run out but I am still in that hood. This person would be crazy not to at least try revenge on me when they wake up. In 2 days I have managed almost 100k from robberies, attacks. Including attacks on me. So far only 2 people have successfully managed to rob my hood, once each in the last 2 days.

I wish I had that problem...I'm level 35, and I never come across anyone with high-level buildings that give substantial cash. I'm pretty stoked when I see an ice cream shop at level 3, I really don't ever see higher than that and it's eligible to be robbed.

rustbinlid
09-17-2011, 10:49 PM
Money is an issue of course. Some silly prices for upgrading buildings. None of my own are higher than 7, but there are others on my current level 42 with 8's and the odd 9.

Synergy
09-18-2011, 01:12 AM
Ok I believe some changes have been made in this department. Things are definitely different for me and I love how it's working now. If I'm not delirious and things have een changed, mad props to the devs. Things seem much more balanced now.

theONE
01-26-2012, 04:48 AM
hi, although i'm a noob, from what i've learnt playing this game is that even your targeting people who are stronger then you i.e use the defense is halved concept its best to attack lower level money buildings, the higher the level the less chance you can win.

game still pisses me off as i've noticed that those who increase their stats from the beginning i.e have over 200-300 brass knuckles or have 400 revolvers from the start they use that ability to get stronger then use there new found weapons to to ADD to there additional stats i.e there new weapon MAY take over there weaker ones but stats that their low weapons gave them doesn't diminish

not fair as if you start to collect loot items or what not later rather then soon, you can't catch up to there power EVEN if you farm powerful items like M4's. I've met idiots with 8000 to 10,000 attack and defense.

thats the only thing that pisses me off, not being able to rob is not THAT bad, because its not like you can buy much anyways with so little amount of money, my problem i mentioned is an actual problem. Try stopping a 8000 attack rate user from robbing or raping you up the butt.

Max Power
01-26-2012, 04:53 AM
OK, stop topping ancient threads and stop whining that it took you so long to figure out the game.

Anubis
01-26-2012, 06:49 AM
Funny reading ~Cooz comment 'Im level 35'. Massive necro for a rant. Also, how come your such a low level synergy if you been playing that long? I got a friend in my mafia called synergy whose in the 160's (or there about) I thought was you.

blondealex
01-26-2012, 06:50 AM
OK, stop topping ancient threads and stop whining that it took you so long to figure out the game.
wow this is an old thread, agree with Max

Swifty
01-26-2012, 07:08 AM
thanks for the necro rant

very entertaining

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Babytway
01-26-2012, 08:39 AM
i have had no problem with robberies lately...
Are you noticing that the ppl you were robbing before you can not rob them now?
what has happened/changed that made robberies more difficult?

Synergy
01-26-2012, 11:31 AM
Funny reading ~Cooz comment 'Im level 35'. Massive necro for a rant. Also, how come your such a low level synergy if you been playing that long? I got a friend in my mafia called synergy whose in the 160's (or there about) I thought was you.

Yeah that's me. About to hit 164. I'm just taking my time and not trying to race to 200 bro, and it's been working great for me. I'm stronger than most at my level because of it I believe. Also only have like 1800 Energy. Been putting skill points to other things. Don't see the point of trying to lvl any faster. The game will last longer this way :) Plus once you get into the 160's you have to accumulate a ridiculous amount of xp to level. And baby, this thread is way old. Nothing has changed recently.

Babytway
01-26-2012, 03:36 PM
oh okay thanks Synergy, i didnt notice the date on the first post

Anubis
01-26-2012, 04:32 PM
This is the whole thing about necro's babyt, the info in them is generally way out of date and not relevant anymore.

Not to say Necroposting is always a bad thing, sometimes they bring back to discussion stuff that is still very relevant. But to necro and rant with nothing really relevant is one of the worst necroposts you can do.

Leetfeet
01-28-2012, 10:12 AM
Been playing for 8ish months now, I think, and currently level 56.

If anyone still need help in this thread, it's difficult to say anything specific if you don't post your mafia size. You dont need to be specific about skill point allocation, but that migth also be an indicator as to why you are struggling.

Attack/defense without mafia size = nobody can help.

Joeycool
01-28-2012, 10:54 AM
This thread is nearly 6 months old leetfeet!

Leetfeet
01-28-2012, 12:00 PM
... yea, i know! Just dusting the shelves..

*slowly steppes back*

:o

Tramp Stamp
02-09-2012, 12:00 PM
User Reiseetaupe warned for thread necro.

User whocareswhatmynameis warned for spamming.

whocareswhatmynameis
02-09-2012, 12:05 PM
User Reiseetaupe warned for thread necro.

User whocareswhatmynameis warned for spamming.

ssshhhh... quiet. i am scared of getting caught in the spam dragnet again.